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View Full Version : James Cameron's Avatar (spoilers galore!)



Teebonesy
06-29-2009, 08:00 PM
Cameron Previews 24 Minutes of Avatar Movie (http://www.avatar-movie.org/page/Cameron+Previews+24+Minutes+of+Avatar+Movie)

http://image.wetpaint.com/image/1/uDYrFtS_0AliBsu_cUG7qA45229/GW396H217

I've been following this film since the beginning, as James Cameron's a filmmaker I've closely watched since I was - quite literally - a little boy. Ridley Scott's Alien blew my mind and was the first film I saw as a child - age 6 - that made me want to become a filmmaker.

And then my dad told me there was a sequel where Space Marines fight an entire hive of Aliens.

You can picture my little 6 year old brain exploding. From that moment on, James Cameron was my second dad.

It's become so fashionable to hate Titanic among anyone who's ever seen a single indie film, that it's usually me that comes to the movie's rescue and champions it in the face of all the criticism.

This is a filmmaker who has managed to push the boundaries of filmmaking with almost every movie he's done. True Lies didn't really push boundaries, but it was a hilarious self-parody, and one of the funniest action movies I've seen. But otherwise, this guy, a technical mastermind, has always strived to give people something new, and to push filmmaking forward in some way - usually in the field of the visual effects.

Now he's half a decade into Avatar, his first feature film since Titanic, sporting one of the biggest budgets for a single film in Hollywood history. He's been pioneering entirely new filmmaking techniques which are so novel and unique that it's drawn in the likes of Peter Jackson, Steven Spielberg, Robert Zemeckis, and other filmmakers who have stopped by the set to learn a thing or two about how this movie's being made. The techniques involve new ways to film live-action and CG mixed together. it involves a lot of "virtual" technology - a virtual camera, virtual actors, a virtual set.

It's coming out later this year. Here are some snippets of quotes people have about the 20 minute preview they've seen:

"THIS WILL CHANGE MOVIES FOREVER. Trust me, it will."

"If it's anything like the scenes I saw, it's going to be one of the best movies of the decade."

"I'm still feeling the after effects of this jaw-dropping experience. "

"The beauty completely takes my breath away."

"You will NOT believe the detail."

"This movie will change the industry."

"I had a hard time putting it to words. You just can't fully do it."

----

So those are some strong words. Many of which are troubling. Do I WANT the film industry to change forever toward MORE CG and LESS onscreen human performance? Especially considering that the reason this movie looks as good as it does isn't just because the technology is finally there - it's because James Cameron is at the helm. Michael Bay's not going to be able to make something like this. Neither are MOST big-budget filmmakers. Cameron bridges that gap between perfectionist art and giant spectacle.

I'm all for Fantasy films being taken in incredible new directions, as long as we don't end up seeing second-rate Avatar clones left right and center, which might happen in the coming decade.

Cameron himself has said that he doesn't know if this movie will turn out amazing or terrible (5 years on a movie will do that to you), but he does know that it will be a spectacle the likes of which nobody's seen before. Considering his pedigree, this is one bit of hype I would absolutely believe.

I'm calling it right now though. For better or for worse, Avatar, in 2009, is going to set the stage for the next decade of filmmaking. What we're going to be seeing from 2010 to 2019 is going to harken back to this movie. It will be considered a seminal technological achievement in storytelling. Whether the actual story and characters are as masterful won't be as important - but know that with Cameron you're in good hands there as well. "Masterful", maybe not, but fun, engaging, exciting - absolutely.

I for one will be in line early on December 18th to see this film. I'm smart enough to know what to do with hype, where to put it, and how to analyze it. But I was ready to line up for this movie before anyone saw a frame of it. The reaction it's garnered in the sneak peek is heartening to say the least.

Anyone else getting excited?

Syroc
06-29-2009, 08:09 PM
Interesting.

Though at first I thought this was about that anime. ^.^

Teebonesy
06-29-2009, 08:10 PM
Haha... i thought that might happen. I edited the title to clarify.

Dexiro
06-29-2009, 08:32 PM
Nice to hear that you want to become a filmmaker - I like hearing peoples aspirations :)

I've never heard of this movie before but you've definatly gotten me excited about it :D
I have no idea what it's about at the moment, but judging from that image that you posted this is going to be the kind of movie that i won't forget easily :p

Morgana25
06-29-2009, 08:37 PM
The still shot looks amazing. I'm all for heavy CG in a film but it can't be the only thing in a film. I'll check this out for sure. He does have an amazing talent to make great films.

Teebonesy
06-29-2009, 08:54 PM
To give a bit of background on the story:

Pandora is a planet in the Alpha Centauri system which humans have recently discovered. It's a lush alien place with trees a mile high, glowing foliage, and full of strange creatures and minerals. The humans, as you can imagine, are hungry for resources, and Pandora is rife with them.

Living on the planet is an intelligent race known as Na'Vie. They're incredibly tall, blue-skinned humanoids with large yellow eyes and tails. They live in harmony with their planet, and haven't developed complex digital machinery. It's bow-and-arrows for them, and a society that shares and lives with the creatures and life around it. They ride huge flying pterodactyl-like animals to traverse the massive world.

With the humans bearing down on Pandora, a war is about to break out, and at the center of it is a wounded wheelchair-bound ex-Marine named Jake Sully. He's been sent to Pandora as part of the human endeavor to explore and eventually own Pandora. To do so, his mind is projected into an "avatar" body, a Na'Vi body that he will be able to control and inhabit so that he can live on the planet and learn everything he can. From there, as you can imagine, things don't go quite as he expected.

The major buzz right now is that the CG looks absolutely photorealistic. Forget about concept art or descriptions of how the Na'Vi look. The buzz is that these creatures are absolutely living, breathing, amazingly, eye-poppingly real people, with the flicker of a soul in the eyes.

The world itself, according to the reports, is jaw droppingly gorgeous, and also looks photorealistic.

It's also pushing the boundaries of 3D stereoscopic filmmaking. So you're going to be wearing those big 3D glasses, and as it will be a long movie, please do yourself a favor and make sure you get good seats. you do NOT want to end up in the front row for this one.

midnight_heist
06-29-2009, 09:12 PM
Sounds promising. I hope the creature designs are cool. Any concept art out yet?

Teebonesy
06-29-2009, 09:25 PM
For the Aliens fans out there:

http://4.bp.blogspot.com/_1qPLMlz01yQ/Sh6DY5k07vI/AAAAAAAADIc/8oE5IQMcvxQ/s400/ScreenHunter_21+May.+28+09.26.gif

http://1.bp.blogspot.com/_1qPLMlz01yQ/Sh6EZp2mqrI/AAAAAAAADIk/h5JcSPvmeVE/s400/ScreenHunter_22+May.+28+09.27.gif

And early concept art for the Na'Vi:

http://chud.com/articles/content_images/5/navi2.jpg

rtm223
06-29-2009, 09:38 PM
I read up about this film and some interview with key people involved acouple of weeks ago. They all seemed to be spouting about the "importance" of the film without anything to back them up. "the first new universe we ahve seen in film since star wars" was a big lie that I remember reading.

I'm also not entirely sure what is revolutionary about it (I can't watch that vid at the moment - will take a look at it at work tomo). All I've seen so far is an incremental improvement in tech that's been developing for a decade.

I'm sure the film will be amazing, Cameron is a very good director, and the visuals will be incredible. But all I have seen so far is a lot of hype and buzzwords, pretty pictures, and not much else...

Dexiro
06-29-2009, 09:40 PM
Wow the more i hear the more i can't wait to see this xD

For those who aren't so sure about the CGI thing, remember what the cutscenes in Uncharted were like? :D
The acting was amazing and made it really believable, i'd happily sit through an entire movie of those cutscenes :p

Now imagine even better acting and much more realistic graphics... I'm sure noone will be disappointed :)

Teebonesy
06-30-2009, 12:00 AM
I read up about this film and some interview with key people involved acouple of weeks ago. They all seemed to be spouting about the "importance" of the film without anything to back them up...

I'm also not entirely sure what is revolutionary about it

One of the trails being blazed is HOW Cameron has been making this film. It's drawn the interest of the industry's top filmmakers who have stopped by to watch his pioneered system at work. Variances of this have been tinkered with a bit in the past, but nothing, on any scale, has come close to the extent to which Cameron and his crew have taken this new kind of "virtual filmmaking". One of the reasons this has taken so long is that they're inventing as they go.

Imagine an enormous soundstage. Unlike a CG animated film, this movie was filmed, with actors and a full crew, onstage. The actors have motion capture suits - nothing new there - with the addition of a camera sensor attached to them which captures their entire facial performance and sends it in real time to the computers.

All around the soundstage are sensors which capture in 3D the entire performance.

Rather than capture the performance and then add the backgrounds later, they've created the backgrounds and environments, the virtual sets - first. So now imagine Cameron on set with a "mothership" village where he can change dynamically all sorts of things:
"It's this form of pure creation where if you want to move a tree or a mountain or the sky or change the time of day, you have complete control over the elements... It’s like a big, powerful game engine. If I want to fly through space, or change my perspective, I can. I can turn the whole scene into a living miniature and go through it on a 50 to 1 scale." ( James Cameron)

Now imagine that, in addition to the mothership, he also has portable cameras which he can set up and bring into the set with him - what they're looking at is a virtual set with actors in mocap suits. What Cameron sees on his monitor is a lush jungle environment with Na'Vi aliens in place of the actors. On top of this, the system allows actors to interact with virtual characters who aren't actually there, and all of this interaction is visible on the set monitors - they don't have to wait until post to see what it will look like. Of course it's all a "preview" render - the final renders for the film are polished and intense - each frame takes 50 hours to render, and has to be rendered twice because the film is in 3D. The render farm necessary to undertake such a task is probably one of the reasons why the budget on this movie is so astronomical.

This isn't Transformers. It's not Van Helsing. Hell, it's not even King Kong or Lord of the Rings, and it's not Beowulf. This is a movie that's almost, but not quite, entirely CG, an alternate universe in which great attention has been paid to the culture of the Na'Vi people and the detail of their world, and which was shot 100% by people and with mostly real actors, in a virtual make-believe world that could change and be interacted with on the fly.

Cameron most likely knows, more than anyone else in the industry, how to shoot in 3D as well. If you haven't been sold on it with all the kiddy animated CG cartoons that have been coming out in recent years, or Beowulf, then don't worry - Cameron's got something special for you with this one. He's setting out to make what will possibly be one of the most IMMERSIVE movies ever made.

Dexiro
06-30-2009, 12:43 AM
Wow 50 hours to render each frame? that's insane o_o

For the past 2 hours i've been trying to imagine what this movie will be like and matching my thoughts to the responses - but i just can't do it!
I've either set my expectations too high or this movie is going to be too good to comprehend :p

hilightnotes
06-30-2009, 04:36 AM
Ok, I'm excited!

Thanks for bringing my attention to this teebonesy!!
I know almost nothing about this, but you've gotten me very excited! :D

Teebonesy
06-30-2009, 09:45 AM
I recall that on The Lord of the Rings, certain scenes heavy on CG took 2 full days to render a single frame. It doesn't all take that long, and massive render farms can be utilized to take that number down a bit. But without the render farms, and assuming that every single frame in the movie contained maximum CGI, this movie would take 2,500 YEARS to render out fully. So, hey, maybe we should be happy it only took 5 years.

Just to put this in a bit of perspective, a lot of the folks who saw this aren't JUST hype-peddlers like those jerks at Ain't it Cool. Here are some quotes from the Technology editor for Time magazine:

the morning after screening the 20 minutes, he had a strange and unexpected yearning to return to Pandora. He says he's still reeling from the experience.

"It was like doing some kind of drug."

Now to further address what is so groundbreaking about this movie -

So far we've seen a lot of 3D movies, from Dreamworks animation and Disney/Pixar and Fox. They've all been cartoons, and oftentimes the 3D is a bit gimmicky. We haven't really seen it utilized very seriously yet. Cameron's been pushing the 3D technology as far as he can. The Time editor said that in a scene where these glowing dusty flakes drift from a huge mystical tree, he could feel them landing on his arm. It becomes so immersive that it engages your brain in ways that movies never usually do. In screening it, Cameron has described it as "dreaming with your eyes wide open."

Another thought here, as I realize that I'm only adding more and more fuel to the hype fire here. Cameron's also responded to this sudden influx of hype. He's said publicly that he doesn't want people to become too hyped up and expect something they're not getting. To be safe, he says, if you're finding yourself overexcited, it's best to assume that "Whatever you think it’s going to be, it’s probably not."

That said, I honestly don't think I've been this excited to see a movie since Jurassic Park.

Stix489
06-30-2009, 10:16 AM
This all looks and sounds extremely interesting.

I'm looking forward to see this movie and immerse myself in the experience.

Now, is there some sort of trailer? I know I've seen one trailer, and it included time lapse and what not, but is that it? Nothing really revealing?

Teebonesy
07-01-2009, 07:30 AM
This all looks and sounds extremely interesting.

I'm looking forward to see this movie and immerse myself in the experience.

Now, is there some sort of trailer? I know I've seen one trailer, and it included time lapse and what not, but is that it? Nothing really revealing?

No, that's just some fan-made mockup trailer, it has nothing to do with the actual movie.

The 3D aspect is a MUCH bigger part of this film than with other 3D films on the market these days. With Pixar movies for example, the 3D is kind of a bonus, many theaters don't feature it, and you're not missing out on much without it. Avatar is built from the ground-up as a fully immersive 3D experience. So that means they've got to figure out how to market it. If we're going to see TV spots and trailers online and in theaters for 2D movies, obviously we're going to be missing the 3D element.

That doesn't mean they won't show them - they surely will. You'll see a lot of "From the director of Titanic" selling the movie. But other than that, how they're going to give peeks of this movie to the public I'll be curious to see.

Teebonesy
08-18-2009, 09:52 PM
Should've posted in here a bit earlier, but it might not be too late for some people.

This Friday is Avatar Day, a groundbreaking attempt at hype-building for an unusual movie that couldn't really be marketed traditionally. The filmmakers know that the real spectacle of what they have is dependent on the 3D experience, so how do you market it?

Well, they're having a free 15-minute sneak preview of the movie and debuting the trailer at 3D imax theaters around the country. That's going down this Friday. most tickets have been "sold out", there are still some left. go to http://www.avatarmovie.com/ticketing to check for theaters in your area and rsvp for a couple of tickets.

If you're in the Seattle area I might be able to hook you up with a couple.

I'm SOL because there's nothing in Vancouver... NOTHING! Which really quite ****** me off actually. And I'm working that day so i can't exactly bus it down to Seattle in a hurry to catch it. So no Avatar Day for me, I'll just have to wait until Christmas for the movie.

I highly recommend anyone who can to get your tickets, particularly if you don't know a **** thing about Avatar and don't really care, because I think you'll be pleasantly surprised - and it's free.

Astrosimi
08-18-2009, 10:59 PM
Miami's sold out :/

However after reading most of your posts my mind exploded and I could surely wait for Christmas.

Zwollie
08-20-2009, 05:23 PM
The trailer is out and it looks...I can't describe it with words but it looks amazing!!
http://www.movie-list.com/trailers.php?id=avatar

Teebonesy
08-20-2009, 06:52 PM
Here's another link, same trailer: http://www.apple.com/trailers/fox/avatar/

Yeah, I'm not sure what to say just at the moment. It's weird to finally see the movie in action. I think there are some weird editing choices. Sort of freezing the picture/slowing it down in those few segments is awkward. Having zero dialogue throughout the whole trailer except for one line: "This is great!" is also definitely weird.

But what else is there to say... It's DEFINITELY Dances With Wolves in space, as Cameron has suggested. There looks to be approximately zero subtlety in this movie! The humans are badass, scar-covered, MEAN SOBs... The navi look like blue elven Mohicans. I think we can see where this is going.

That being said, it is very.... VERY weird to see the closeups of the Navi. It's like a person's face but just this side of alien... but still looks as real as anything. Incredibly trippy.

I think the most impressive parts are the scenery. The trees, the jungle, the floating islands, the giant land pillars... I mean it looks absolutely photorealistic, it looks like the thing was shot on location! Like they really went there. It looks effing amazing. Now I just need to see it on the big screen...

Zwollie
08-20-2009, 07:06 PM
Thanks for reposting my link to the same files. ;)

I personally love the absence of text as this is not a full trailer yet and is clearly intended to build more hype, raise even more questions and give you an overload of the greatest CGI I have seen so far.

I was also really impressed with the scenery, that overhead shot of the jungle looked absolutely amazing!!

I honestly can't even imagine what this will look like in 3d!!

mrsupercomputer
08-20-2009, 07:22 PM
I think the trailer looks pretty freaking awesome, but I'd be lying if I said that the CG didn't bring back memories of the Star Wars Prequels. Now, I fully expect this to be a better film than those atrocities, but I guess I just expected more from the cgi work (at least on the navi, the scenery is outstanding). It doesn't really look all that revolutionary to me. That said, I still think it looks great and I can't wait to see it.

hilightnotes
08-20-2009, 09:27 PM
When I first saw a human in the trailer, I was like "Wait, I thought this was supposed to be CGI??" :p

Anyways, one thing's for sure: it LOOKS incredible. Will it be a great movie? I think we'll have to wait until it's out for that to be answered.

ARD
08-20-2009, 09:36 PM
They just showed this on the news.
So, yeah.

Teebonesy
08-21-2009, 12:41 AM
In case people here aren't checking the video out in full HD, I too the liberty of taking a few detail shots.
2 Navi shots:

Navi through foliage ('http://imgur.com/BQyyi.png')

Navi closeup ('http://imgur.com/evnEv.png')

The roots of the effing Mana tree burning ('http://imgur.com/Gq9ek.png')

Note that these are NOT full screenshots, they'd be too big, and if I reduced their size, what's the point of posting them? This is mainly for people who haven't seen it in HD or don't have the bandwidth.

Teebonesy
08-22-2009, 08:50 AM
Anyone make it to the screening by any chance? Obviously I couldn't go, but I've talked to a few people in Seattle who went and word so far has been, to say the least, positive.

Actually, I think I could hear the drool dribbling over the phone.

There is a certain sensation of knowing that you're getting a special "sneak" preview that I think raises your excitement level to such a fevered pitch that you're seeing the movie with beer goggles in a way. Hype goggles, perhaps.

BasketSnake
08-22-2009, 09:42 AM
As a CGI movie I'm very impressed but it doesn't look REAL. Transition from animations to something that can trick the brain is not something I see here.

Rustbukkit
08-22-2009, 07:12 PM
While this looks stunning... I can't help but feel the same old wariness of the mixing of live action and CG. It's something that the industry seems to be striving for, but I just don't believe they will ever achieve it with the results they intend. Don't get me wrong, I think it's a valid goal that will serve the film business well... but you can never replace living tissue with CG and make it believable.

The footage looks amazing indeed, and I'm with Teebonesy on his comments of edits and slowing of footage. There really is no need for Matrix shots anymore... it's been done to death!

I will say that I'm disappointed with their decision to go with CG ships as well. Lucas really screwed up the last three films by doing this as well. No amount of CG artistry will ever fully replicate and convince me of tangible metal and paint like a miniature model made of styrene, balsa wood, or resin will. CG simply doesn't capture light the way real objects do. The designs are beautiful, but still look like CG ships and mechs to me.

Still... I'm super excited for the films release! :)

Zwollie
08-23-2009, 05:02 PM
well. Lucas really screwed up the last three films by doing this as well.

What didn't Lucas screw up with CGI in the prequels?? :D
Common, CGI stormtroopers??....why?

Dexiro
08-23-2009, 05:13 PM
I thought the cgi was really believable!

With some parts i was thinking "yeah that's cgi" and then thinking "ah this bit looks real". I'd kind of forgot that it was ALL cgi :p

The Na'vi (are they called that?) looked amazing anyway :D

Can't wait to see this anyway, i bet it looks even better on the big screen!

hilightnotes
08-23-2009, 09:56 PM
I actually made a mistake - it's NOT all CGI, like I thought it was. Dan told me that it's something like 60% or 70% CGI (I forget which).
Some actors you'll notice are real though.

Teebonesy
08-24-2009, 07:02 AM
True, but what happens when watching this is that you'll realize the Na'vi and creatures are CG, but begin to forget completely that all the trees, foliage, jungle, water, etc. is also all CG. It looks that real. And before you know it you'll probably begin to forget the Na'vi are even CG either and just be watching a movie.

Talking with people who have seen the preview on Avatar day, some of the most impressive 3D effects are the live action footage. I heard that it's absolutely astounding, the amount of depth in some of these shots. Guys who have seen plenty of 3D movies say that this movie showed them stuff they didn't even think was possible in a 3D film.

Also, a lot of the footage in the trailer is accounted for in the preview screenings. They're holding back a lot of material. This will probably turn out to be at least 2 and a half hours long, so I'm really excited to see some of the stuff we haven't glimpsed yet. Being James Cameron, I'd wager there's a good chance at seeing what lives underwater on Pandora...

supersickie
08-25-2009, 04:40 PM
I'm every bit as amped up for Cameron's Avatar as you, Teebonesy. I won't pretend that I've been following the film since inception. The truth is I saw the trailer in 1080p and couldn't do anything but watch it over and over again. I've been reading as much as I can about the film including production and I really don't think there's been anything of this magnitude attempted this generation.

One could argue that The Lord of the Rings pushed boundaries and that's certainly true to an extent. But, as Teebonesy said, Cameron looks to change the way movies are made with this ambitious title. I don't even know if I can fully comprehend such a thing.

In my mind, I see Blade Runner and Apocalypse Now as evolutionary films due to the drive of Ridley Scott and Francis Coppola respectively. Somehow, I think Avatar looks to go beyond even that level of ambition. Again, I don't know that I can fully comprehend what we'll get come December 18, but I know it'll be nothing short of special and - if Cameron gets his way - we'll be right back in light to witness the phenomena all over again.

Teebonesy
08-25-2009, 08:08 PM
There's no doubt the movie will be a huge hit, which means we can expect 2 more - he's said that if this is successful over the long run he'll make an Avatar trilogy.

As for the new methods, Robert Zemeckis has already announced that he's going to be utilizing Cameron's pioneering filmmaking techniques in his next movie... a CG remake of Yellow Submarine.

*forehead slap*

I mean, that'll be one trippy 3D movie with a ton of awesome visuals, but wow, way to pick a movie that doesn't need to be remade. It's literally nothing but crazy visuals. Considering I live in Vancouver, I don't think I'll be able to see that one at the theater without a strong skunky smell wafting over the room...

Spielberg and Peter Jackson have also stopped by to peek what he's been up to. Spielberg is likely implementing a lot of this stuff in his upcoming CG/Performance-capture Tintin movie. As for Peter Jackson, I have no idea what he's got up his sleeves.

Kipmonlin
08-25-2009, 08:13 PM
It looks amazing and I'm keeping the trailer on my desktop until I get a chance to see this movie :D.

I have no problem suspending disbelief over how future humans can inhabit avatars but can't cure paralysis as someone pointed out in an article.

Rhyfelwr
08-25-2009, 09:19 PM
Haven't seen it but love the trailers.

Any idea who did the cgi? The Mill? Weta?

This is easily my kind of film and Alien was one of my favourite films when I was younger. As you say, the first two in the original Alien trilogy set the standard in the genre... indeed, they became the genre.

I'm looking forward to this one.

Teebonesy
08-25-2009, 10:33 PM
It looks amazing and I'm keeping the trailer on my desktop until I get a chance to see this movie :D.

I have no problem suspending disbelief over how future humans can inhabit avatars but can't cure paralysis as someone pointed out in an article.

I'm with you on this one - there's just something compelling and very satisfying in the story of a sort of depressed, paralyzed man who gets to inhabit this new, incredible body, can run and move again, find a new life. Complaints about this being unrealistic are so beside the point - if you can't be engaged by a story like that, then clearly you're in the wrong movie!


Any idea who did the cgi? The Mill? Weta?

Weta Digital did the effects. Makes sense that the company who created Gollum would have some hand in this.

Rhyfelwr
08-26-2009, 09:55 AM
Makes sense that the company who created Gollum would have some hand in this.

I wonder if Serkis pops up at some point :)

Yeah, Peter Jackson and Weta have done some absolutely stunning work in LOTR.

Teebonesy
08-26-2009, 10:09 AM
I wonder if Serkis pops up at some point :)


Honestly, after Heavenly Sword, I'm happy on my Serkis-Hiatus thank you very much!

Holy GOD was he over the top in that game!! And considering that he directed the rest of the actors, he certainly didn't seem to reign anyone else in either...

rtm223
08-26-2009, 12:15 PM
Heh, did you watch the bonus features where they were going on about how people will remember heavenly sword as the game that sparked off a more cinematic feel to computer games with better acting and storytelling than ever before... Or something. It was rather amusing.

I don't think Weta were involved though, not as far as I can tell anyway. - Nope they definately are...

supersickie
08-26-2009, 02:50 PM
Just watched an IGN Rewind with the Avatar teaser. They pick up on some seemingly telling details. It's going to be hard to wait four months for this film.

I need more meat, Mr. Cameron! A full trailer, something, please!

Teebonesy
08-26-2009, 09:33 PM
Heh, did you watch the bonus features where they were going on about how people will remember heavenly sword as the game that sparked off a more cinematic feel to computer games with better acting and storytelling than ever before... Or something. It was rather amusing.

I don't think Weta were involved though, not as far as I can tell anyway.

"Cameron Taps Weta Digital for Avatar

Academy Award® winner Joe Letteri and Weta Digital have signed on to create visual effects, creatures and digital environments for James Cameron’s much-anticipated and innovative new motion picture, Avatar. “Weta has proven themselves a leader in visionary effects, especially in the area of performance capture based character animation, which is a big part of my new film,” says writer/director James Cameron."

that's pretty funny about Heavenly Sword. No, nobody really remembers THAT game. Although I thought it had a great combat system, some cool areas... mostly EFFING OBNOXIOUS cutscenes with Andy Serkis taking the whole thing tumbling over the top... But I definitely haven't seen better faces or expressions in a videogame to date. Nariko's close-ups were always incredible.

rtm223
08-26-2009, 09:46 PM
Academy Award® winner Joe Letteri and Weta Digital have signed on to create visual effects,

Yup, indeed they have, my cusory glance earlier showed nothing on the weta site. Now I can see it listed on their site. I'm pretty sure they must have just done an update in the last 6 hours or so though :rolleyes: notihng to do with my looking skills at all :p

Teebonesy
10-29-2009, 10:06 PM
The new trailer is out today:

http://www.traileraddict.com/trailer/avatar/trailer-b

or if you're in the states, higher quality here:

http://movies.yahoo.com/movie/1809804784/video

It's definitely another "broadcast the entire movie in the trailer" trailer.

Anyone else feel like this is Dances with Wolves rolled up with Dune, done in gigantic James Cameron style?
Dune-ces with Wolves, perhaps?

supersickie
10-29-2009, 11:01 PM
Certainly epic. Waiting for the 1080p version to hit Apple.com. I feel like I know a ton about the plot now; not a lot left to the imagination though.

Looks to be great.

SHENOA77
10-29-2009, 11:13 PM
Oh yeah. The first trailer was little more than a bunch of pretty pictures, and even the 16-minute preview, although it was cool, didn’t make me care for the characters. This new full-length trailer… does what the previous two have not: gives me a real reason to want to see the movie.

hilightnotes
10-30-2009, 02:59 AM
Wow, incredible trailer. It looks like it'll be one helluv an epic movie.

That said, it doesn't look like it'll be a quality movie in the sense of its content. But it looks incredible, and whether it's got any depth to it I'm sure it'll be great fun to see.

Whalio Cappuccino
10-30-2009, 05:17 AM
Oh my God was that epic or what.

I can't believe I never knew about this until now, this is amazing. Can't wait.

Teebonesy
10-30-2009, 05:52 AM
It's definitely got massive spectacle going for it. One thing these trailers do really well is they remind you, when you're watching the first act of the movie, that there are some HUGE things in store for you down the road. Last movie I saw that kind of gave me that feeling was Lord of the Rings, it's been a while since I've had a movie theater experience that really gave me that feeling.

In 3D Imax, this thing is going to be awe-inspiring.

Whalio Cappuccino
10-30-2009, 05:56 AM
It's definitely got massive spectacle going for it. One thing these trailers do really well is they remind you, when you're watching the first act of the movie, that there are some HUGE things in store for you down the road. Last movie I saw that kind of gave me that feeling was Lord of the Rings, it's been a while since I've had a movie theater experience that really gave me that feeling.

In 3D Imax, this thing is going to be awe-inspiring.

Wait, it's going to be in 3D?

Teebonesy
10-30-2009, 06:02 AM
Wait, it's going to be in 3D?

The 3D in fact is kind of the entire point of this one! James Cameron has made it a major cinematic priority to pioneer 3D filmmaking with this movie, and he put off making the film until the technology was available, he's spent his career since Titanic working on the 3D system with which to do it, and has said on many occasions that the movie needs to be seen in 3D to get the full experience. It's designed from the ground up for it. Believe me, you're going to want to hunt down a 3D imax for this movie!

Whalio Cappuccino
10-30-2009, 06:07 AM
The 3D in fact is kind of the entire point of this one! James Cameron has made it a major cinematic priority to pioneer 3D filmmaking with this movie, and he put off making the film until the technology was available, he's spent his career since Titanic working on the 3D system with which to do it, and has said on many occasions that the movie needs to be seen in 3D to get the full experience. It's designed from the ground up for it. Believe me, you're going to want to hunt down a 3D imax for this movie!

Oh will definitely do that. Thanks for the information, wow I can't wait.

supersickie
11-04-2009, 01:50 AM
HD trailer is up on Apple.com...

http://www.apple.com/trailers/fox/avatar/hd/

Teebonesy
11-04-2009, 04:31 AM
HD trailer is up on Apple.com...

http://www.apple.com/trailers/fox/avatar/hd/

Yes, thank you for the link - I haven't been able to see it in HD yet, because the yahoo link doesn't work in Canada.

Teebonesy
12-02-2009, 01:40 AM
60 Minutes specials, featurettes, tv spots all over the place, a South Park episode... This movie's shifting into high-hype gear in the few weeks we have left until release. Some places are already selling reserve tickets. I've got mine purchased for the biggest Imax screen in the Pacific Northwest for the opening midnight showing, and am planning on probably pulling a 6 or 7-hour line wait to get good seats. I haven't been this excited about a new movie in a long time.

I saw the trailer again the other night before The Road, and it really occurred to me as I watched the giant machines, mech armors, dropships, battles, and extreme level of spectacle that James Cameron is BACK, in a way we haven't seen in a looong time. This is the James Cameron we all knew and loved years back. He took a long hiatus for over a decade, made a little thing called Titanic that wasn't exactly token "Cameron", but holy crap is the old guy back. This looks like every single James Cameron movie rolled into one.

Hybrid
12-02-2009, 03:32 PM
they stole the story from Dancing with smurfs!
[WARING]Mutch Cursing in this Video not for below 14[WARNING]
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lvJkRZPzlYc&feature=related

ontopic:
i whant to see it :D

Boomy
12-02-2009, 07:12 PM
Going to see it at the imax :)

supersickie
12-03-2009, 03:23 PM
60 Minutes specials, featurettes, tv spots all over the place, a South Park episode... This movie's shifting into high-hype gear in the few weeks we have left until release. Some places are already selling reserve tickets. I've got mine purchased for the biggest Imax screen in the Pacific Northwest for the opening midnight showing, and am planning on probably pulling a 6 or 7-hour line wait to get good seats. I haven't been this excited about a new movie in a long time.

I saw the trailer again the other night before The Road, and it really occurred to me as I watched the giant machines, mech armors, dropships, battles, and extreme level of spectacle that James Cameron is BACK, in a way we haven't seen in a looong time. This is the James Cameron we all knew and loved years back. He took a long hiatus for over a decade, made a little thing called Titanic that wasn't exactly token "Cameron", but holy crap is the old guy back. This looks like every single James Cameron movie rolled into one.

You're lucky man. Given my physical situation, I have to convince a buddy of mine that Avatar is going to be awesome (I know this, but somehow he doesn't quite see it) and that we need to drive two hours to watch it in Imax. I'm being pretty aggressive about wanting to see it; hopefully, he'll cave sooner than later.

Teebonesy
12-03-2009, 08:40 PM
You're lucky man. Given my physical situation, I have to convince a buddy of mine that Avatar is going to be awesome (I know this, but somehow he doesn't quite see it) and that we need to drive two hours to watch it in Imax. I'm being pretty aggressive about wanting to see it; hopefully, he'll cave sooner than later.

Ah, that's rough. Keep on him, maybe he just needs to figure, hey, make a trip out of it - it's fun. You get out of town for a few hours, and basically hang out for a while, and in the process see a mind-blowing movie experience. I'm with you obviously, I say take the trip out, go out of your way if necessary to see it in Imax.

Hell, I've gone way out of my way in the past to see movies that were sort of disappointments considering. I drove out once to see Brotherhood of the Wolf. That's not exactly the top of the "go out of your way" movie heap. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed it, but it's no "Dark Knight" exactly.

By the way, to give you a bit of extra perspective - I saw Dark Knight in Imax, a third of which was actually filmed on the 70mm Imax format - the first movie to ever do this - and it was perhaps the most incredible movie theater experience I've had. it doesn't hold up to the nostalgia of seeing Jurassic Park or The Matrix of course. But, as an adult, at a point where I thought it was completely impossible to do this, Dark Knight in Imax refreshed my excitement for what movies can do in theaters. It was freaking incredible. I saw it a second time on a regular movie screen and instantly felt like I was watching a different movie altogether, the experience was so fundamentally changed.

It's not like this with other movies I've seen "blown up" to Imax, like The Watchmen. And considering Avatar's going to be in 3D, it's going to be far, far more important to get good seats, because a giant screen + 3D effect + bad seating + long visually spectacular movie = brain-**** migraine forevermore. Or so I imagine...

AbstractFlesh
12-04-2009, 12:10 AM
I have gotten the game on the day it came out! Not bad for a movie-to-game! Although barely anybody has it 8( Cannot wait to go see the movie!

Teebonesy
12-04-2009, 04:04 AM
I haven't heard terribly positive things about the game. Seems to have fallen into the classic "movie tie-in" trap that games tend to have. If I had a 3D-capable TV I'd surely pick this up just to check out the 3D capability, but alas.

Edit:

here's a link to a 60 Minutes feature on the movie.

Part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXVIzc7OeuU)

Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGdozbBM4Cs&feature=related)

supersickie
12-04-2009, 12:45 PM
Edit:

here's a link to a 60 Minutes feature on the movie.

Part 1 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PXVIzc7OeuU)

Part 2 (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sGdozbBM4Cs&feature=related)

Can't wait to check these out. Too bad I'm busy tonight, but I know what I'll be doing for a bit tomorrow. Feel free to link me to any other interesting Avatar related pieces you have come across. Thanks, dude!

EDIT: I don't know if anyone watches "Bones", but the "squints" subplot focused on Avatar. A few of them were plotting out how they'd get tickets and how to get the best seats. Funny stuff. I'm so stoked for this movie; I don't know what I'll do if I don't get to see it at Imax.

Teebonesy, will it be that big of a deal if I don't have prime seats at the show? You made it sound like it could be pretty disastrous if I get thrown back into a corner. Truthfully, I'm so desperate to see this thing I'd be happy just to get a glimpse of the thing. Little help, brother.

supersickie
12-07-2009, 12:58 PM
Okay, finally found time to watch the "60 Minutes" feature on Avatar. Wish they would have delved a little deeper than "this movie could change everything". Oh well; I guess I'll just hope for a 5-disc Blu-ray in the spring so I can get my fill of documentaries. Knowing Cameron, there will be plenty of that sort of footage just lying around...

Teebonesy
12-09-2009, 01:11 AM
Okay, finally found time to watch the "60 Minutes" feature on Avatar. Wish they would have delved a little deeper than "this movie could change everything". Oh well; I guess I'll just hope for a 5-disc Blu-ray in the spring so I can get my fill of documentaries. Knowing Cameron, there will be plenty of that sort of footage just lying around...

Interestingly enough, cameron's gone on record as saying he does NOT want the video release to give away much of the behind-the-scenes. He's sick of the "magic" of movies being spoiled by dvds, he sees movies sort of in the classic Georges Milies style, where they're like magic shows, and the audience shouldn't be in on how it was done. So you may end up NOT getting much in the way of documentaries! Not to mention the fact that the 3-disc Titanic DVD was SUPPOSED to be a 4-disc set, including a full-length feature documentary on the making of it. This was cut from the eventual release. Some people think Cameron shut it down for just this reason, others think it might have had to do with him not liking how he was portrayed. If I could get my hands on this unreleased documentary, I would be one squealing-happy schoolchild.

As for seats in the Imax, I wouldn't worry if you're in the back corner. I WOULD worry if you're in the front corner. If you end up in the front row, off to the side, there's a chance you may end up being just miserable. I saw Coraline front-row-center, and it wasn't even imax, and after an hour of the 3D distortion from that angle it felt like my eyes were trying to hide inside my brains.

Dark Knight I had very juicy seats, dead middle and perhaps up a row or two I think is prime imax real estate. The screens are so freaking tall you end up looking upwards more than on other screens perhaps, so I usually go a row or two farther back than I usually do.

Normally, by the way, in common movie theaters, I usually sit in row 5 or 6. Any closer and you start getting distortion, it's just about the closest you can sit without the image distorting, which is perfect for me. I like to FEEL the **** movie. I was never one of those people who go to a movie theater and immediately claim the seats in the far back row. Why pay the exhorbitant movie theater prices if you're going to sit so far back? you might as well watch it on the flatscreen at home.

I'm taking a 4+ hour bus ride to Seattle during the holiday frenzy to see this, and following this ride I'm going to be standing in line at the theater for possibly 6+ hours, and the thing on the forefront of my mind is that I'm going to show up 6 hours early and discover a GIGANTIC LINE-UP. Oh god, please, no. I don't have to be first in line. I just hope to baby jeezy I don't end up at the back of a 100-person lineup at 6 p.m.

My friend and I joke that we were at the front line of Avatar before it was even called "Avatar", and that the movie theater staff should just know this and let us take our first pick of seats. I mean, obviously. Duh.

supersickie
12-10-2009, 06:21 PM
Thanks for all of the info, dude. Somewhat bummed to hear Cameron might not want the "cat out of the bag" so to speak as to how his films are made, but I understand at the same time. That said, it seems trivial in the sense that film lovers like us really just want to feel like we were a part of something more than figuring out how something was done from a production standpoint. I just want as much Avatar as possible, you know?

I wish I could make an adventure out of seeing Avatar the same way you are, but it looks as if I'll have to settle for seeing it soon after release. While I definitely lose the atmosphere of an amped audience, I think I maximize my overall enjoyment by not having to deal with a ton of people and not being rushed around. Seriously though, I can't wait!

toon_army_azza
12-10-2009, 06:39 PM
it took him 10 years to make, it better be a success lol

Boomy
12-10-2009, 07:25 PM
I really hope it lives up too the hype.

Zwollie
12-11-2009, 09:15 AM
I'm gonna go see it on the 16th, luckily we are one of the few countries that gets it a bit earlier. Can't wait!!

jump_button
12-11-2009, 10:38 AM
all i think when I see this movie is Smurf, big Smurfs, and a World of Warcraft love story

it may as well be a GCI movie

this movie to me is like water world nice idea but in the end all you get is sh**

Sackwise
12-11-2009, 03:49 PM
The movie looked really good, but wasn't the most captivating piece of work ever. And I agree with jump_button, it looks like a WoW love story lmfao.

supersickie
12-11-2009, 07:39 PM
The movie looked really good, but wasn't the most captivating piece of work ever. And I agree with jump_button, it looks like a WoW love story lmfao.

So, you've seen it then? Man, I'm really surprised at all of the naysayers around here. We're the self-declared geeks of this generation; I didn't think it could get any better than Avatar...

jump_button
12-11-2009, 10:31 PM
I'am just sick of ppl telling me its going to be good and change movie for ever! .... I dont want more movie like this I dont see how it going to change movies, only way i see will be for the wrost.

Movies like this I put with movies like Transformers made just to show of new GCI over useing it over and over and have nothing real

GCI for me just need to add to what you see

best use for GCI would be like LOTR most of the stuff you see was made by hands for real they only adding in stuff later

hilightnotes
12-12-2009, 04:47 AM
I can't post links cause I'm on my iPod, but a revue of avatar was just released on Avatar. I only read parts of the review because I'm trying to leave the movie as as much of a surprise as possible (after seeng the trailer), but well...

The review basically says it's frikin amazing and blew the reviewer away. He said he wasn't so hyped up for it because it didn't seem THAT amazing from trailers and stuff, but he says the videos don't do it justice. So yeah, basically sounds like it's a cliché, but very well done cliché, movie (in terms of story) that's definitely a must see.

I think I'm going to watch it on the 19th with a few freinds in IMAX. It'll be one of my freind's birthday so it should be a good treat!

Anyways I'm excited to see it. I'll probably stay out if this thread to avoid spoiling myself.

Teebonesy
12-14-2009, 10:08 PM
The critics are seeing it, and the Rotten Tomatoes reviews (http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/avatar/)are coming in now.

To those expecting "Transformers 2", you should really remember the filmmaker we're dealing with here - It's not Michael Bay, and it's not Robert Zemeckis, and it's certainly not Roland Emmerich. It's James Cameron. The James Cameron of "Aliens", of "Terminator 2", of "Titanic". As Roger Ebert put it, this is perhaps the only filmmaker in Hollywood who really knows how to spend obscenely bloated movie budgets.

What Avatar really comes down to, whether you hate CG or not, is the faith you have in the filmmaker. I have the utmost faith in Cameron to render a compelling story that's actually supported by the visual effects, rather than overwhelmed by it. Clearly this is not a particularly original story. As South Park put it, it's "Dances with Smurfs". Cameron himself, in his own words, has described it as "Dances with Wolves in Space".

Like Romeo and Juliet, it's not even remotely the first time such a story has been told. It's just about as old as stories.

What you're getting with this movie is a filmmaking spectacle from the absolute master of the filmmaking spectacle. Don't pay attention to the TV spots that proclaim "movies will never be the same again" - if you're interested in being transported, in seeing something unbelievably epic, I really doubt you're going to lose with Avatar. It's seeing almost universal praise from critics so far. Even the nay-sayers have a hard time NOT recommending it for the sheer scope of the spectacle on display.

I've got my bus tickets purchased - am planning on passing the time in line on Thursday with a little Zelda: Spirit Tracks. Can't wait.

supersickie
12-17-2009, 01:05 PM
Link (http://rogerebert.suntimes.com/apps/pbcs.dll/article?AID=/20091211/REVIEWS/912119998) to Ebert's review. He likes a lot of films, but he writes one hell of a review. I've nearly given up on a trip to Imax this weekend. I think I'll just settle for a 2-D experience. Honestly, it's going to be great either way.

supersickie
12-18-2009, 12:18 PM
I'm demanding a full review from Teebonesy NOW!!!

rtm223
12-18-2009, 12:58 PM
What the hell? I definately posted here on wednesday when I got back from it. Meh, all I can say is that the film was incredible - I was expecting a CGI extravaganza with little substance, so I went in rather sceptical. It was so much more to that.

It has pretty much everything I could ask for in a film. I won't go into any details but I urge everyone to go and see this as soon as possible. I'm probably going back tonight or tomorrow for another watch, then maybe sort a trip to Brum for the IMAX. It honestly is that good.


On a side note - I don't see this film changing the face of films forever. Sure the technical aspects will start to appear more and more, but the technical aspects aren't what make this film what it is, it's just a bloody well crafted film - the awesome visuals are a simply a bonus - the icing on the cake if you like.

Leather-Monkey
12-18-2009, 01:23 PM
Seeing it tomorrow in 3D!

rtm223
12-18-2009, 01:25 PM
Oh yeah I should mention the 3D is awesome as well - you expect it fromt he CGI sections, but even the live action parts are executed with lovely subtle perspective. And of course the blending of the CGI and live action is flawless.

supersickie
12-18-2009, 03:15 PM
From Blu-ray.com:

In the interviews given to promote Avatar, which opens in theaters today, James Cameron has already given a few tips on the Blu-ray of his latest movie epic. The filmmaker said that the BD will include over ten minutes of deleted scenes, and also that the initial Blu-ray release of 'Avatar' "probably won't be in 3-D", and there will be another edition with 3-D support in late 2010.

Cameron told MTV that the discarded footage gave added background on the native Na'vi people of Pandora. "It's all wonderful stuff, but it was sort of bogging down the middle section of the movie," Cameron said. "So there's plenty for a value-added DVD experience on this film. Of course, we'll have to go punch it all up and get it all mixed and stuff like that." There is also a trial ritual where, to become one of the clan, Jake Sully (Sam Worthington) must hunt a local beast.

With regard to whether the Blu-ray release would include 3-D or not, Cameron said: "Probably the initial Blu-ray release of Avatar won't be in 3-D and then a subsequent release will be in 3-D. That's my guess right now. So we will probably put out a disk, you know, in six or eight months, let's call it six months, and then after that we will have a 3-D disc when there are enough sets available."

This will mean that, when released, that BD will utilize the Blu-ray 3D specification...

Teebonesy
12-19-2009, 03:54 AM
Okay, I just got back in from Seattle. Everything went swimmingly - Sure, I waited in line under the space needle for 6 hours, but I was at the tip of the spear so to speak. The small group of uber nerds in front of me chose their seats toward the back - giving me and my 3 buddies PICK OF THE LITTER. Oh, sweet precious day, it was a lovely feeling. We took our time even. Picked out our favorite seats. Second row back from the middle walkway, right in the center. Giant Imax screen. No commercials. No trailers. Just movie. It's definitely up there with my all-time favorite movie theater experiences of all time. If I was a 10-year old getting to see this movie, I think it might be the greatest day of my young life. James Cameron is going to be creating a whole generation of little filmmakers with this movie, much like Spielberg did with my generation.

Firstly: *speechless*

Secondly: *speech*

I had a long trip back to Canada to think about this, but I CANNOT come up with ANY alternative movie experience I've had that, pound for pound, was nearly as FUN as Avatar. Nothing I've seen has been as purely entertaining. Not Jurassic Park in the theater, or The Matrix, or Ghostbusters, or any of my favorite movies - and I'm not calling Avatar my "favorite movie", but what I am saying is that this is the most fun I've probably ever had watching a movie.

Oh my god. Even when it gets really silly - keep in mind the whole thing takes place on an alien world, with alien creatures, and a humanoid alien race that has their own made-up culture - this stuff tends to come across pretty silly at times - but every single little bit of it is UNBELIEVABLY FUN. Oh god, we were just having a ball. By hour 2, the movie could do no wrong for me, and I felt that same vibe throughout the sold-out theater.

Colonel Quaritch was AMAZING. Completely over the top, and a full-bore Cameron character to boot, and a total scene-stealer. I absolutely adored every frame he was in.

This is a movie that literally spends countless minutes just letting you LOOK at the world - scenes in which nothing happens more than the main character touching flowers and feeling dirt and breathing air and LOOKING AT STUFF. And it's AMAZING. You can almost smell the glow-in-the-dark moss.

A mild spoiler below:

There's a scene in which hundreds of the native Na'vi are sitting and performing a prayer ritual of healing to try and save a pretty major character from dying - they sit and sway and chant - in a classic "I believe in fairies" moment, my friends and I got it going in our row, locking arms and swaying and chanting. It was totally ridiculous, and got laughs out of the rest of the theater, but it was a completely pure, hilarious movie-theater-moment that you could not get anywhere else.

This is the kind of mood that was in this theater. You could NOT wipe the grin off the audience's face. And the entire movie is spent acknowledging this. Lines like "you should see your faces" might as well be addressed directly to the audience.

I felt like a little kid. I felt like I was going along with a child's game of "make believe", like I was playing pretend at age 8 all over again, only it was REAL, like I could touch it if I wanted to (I REALLY WANTED TO.) It might be lacking a little bit in memorable or believable dialogue and characterizations - everything is heightened, epic, and extremely colorful. There are some laugh-out-loud moments that probably weren't meant to be, but it was always, always, absolutely fun.

I just saw Zemeckis's "A Christmas Carol" in 3D only days ago. I saw Coraline and Up in 3D. And I can tell you this for a fact - the 3D in Avatar makes pretty much every 3D movie that's come before it look like toys. It was absolutely incredible. This is probably the very first time I've seen a movie in 3D where I felt like it not only helped the movie, but was a CRUCIAL part of it - I peeked out from behind the glasses at a few points in the movie and saw a flat screen with a MOVIE playing on it - it was awful! My window into this incredible, real world was suddenly gone.

I can't say it enough times - seek this one out in 3D, and if possible, Imax. The 3D is a MUST. I'm going to be seeing it again tomorrow with the lady.

It's interesting, I can't imagine caring much for this movie on home video. Even on a big screen TV. It's not so much a movie as it is an experience. This might bring back a bit of that golden age of cinema, before home video, where they'd re-release old favorites like Wizard of Oz theatrically every year. This is a movie I'd rather NEVER SEE at home. This is for a gigantic 3D screen. I was a bit worried for a while that a massive imax screen plus 3D plus Avatar visuals would be complete overkill, but it wasn't - it wasn't at all - watching this movie was a joy I haven't felt in a long time. I wanted to rush home and play with action figures again.

I'm keeping my ticket stub.

EDIT: I just read Ebert's review. He compares his experience seeing Avatar to his first time seeing Star Wars, and describes it basically as the ultimate event movie. It's something that everyone needs to see to be a part of it.
I wouldn't go against him here. You should know going in that there isn't an original story here, or particularly realistic characters. This doesn't matter. Every character is developed colorfully as part of this spectacular operatic event. At every scene's end you will find yourself saying "holy crap that was the most amazing thing I've seen, go back!" only to discover that the next scene manages to outdo it.

I do think this movie has genuinely made for itself a place in the movie history books. It's a landmark movie. It may have DISASTROUS consequences. We might see a long, long series of unbelievably awful CG movies that attempt to recreate it. But unfortunately, there is only one James Cameron, and also unfortunately for other filmmakers who would try to follow him, this movie took half a decade and a third of a billion dollars to craft. It is a frighteningly impassioned piece of storytelling, with a level of detail far surpassing everything that has come before it. It's undeniably a landmark in cinema. That doesn't mean the repercussions of it will be pleasant, but at least we know that Jim Cameron, while Peter Jackson and Steven Spielberg and George Lucas and Robert Zemeckis have become frail (they're now paying their dues to the devil for their successes) - that Cameron, in his hibernation, has grown stronger. We should all be afraid.

Kog
12-19-2009, 05:32 AM
It's not so much a movie as it is an experience.
Wow, as I was walking out of the theater a teenager said: "That was no movie, that was an experience."

And it's true! At some parts I felt asleep from the real world, I felt as if I was in the movie, and it was awesome! And I completely agree with you on the 3D part, this is a MUST SEE in 3D.

I saw it 5 hours ago, and yet, I want to see it again o_0 A movie has never done that before.

But man, I really wanted to be in Pandora, and choose my own (Ikra?) bird-pterodactyl thing, (Without the whole, 'bond' or be killed part :P) Also, the whole bonding thing, and how everything on Pandora was connected with a huge network was pretty awesome.

Anyone else get goosebumps when (Oh man, I just noticed I forgot everyones names! D:) the Na'avi girl was about to go up against all those soldiers, then they sense movement, and the stampede of Hammerhead-Rhinos come out of the forest? I was like: "No! She's going to die :(" Then I was like ":O" then I was like ":DDDDDDDDDDDDDD" and then the military guys got owned, specially the guy in the mech who got crushed. That whole part made me happy, as those soldiers were a bunch of 'meanies'. And I was happy when they got killed by Pandoras epic creatures.

Also (lol) I loved those little glowing geckos that turned into a sort of helicopter, they were just so EPIC! When there was a group of them I was laughing so hard!

rtm223
12-19-2009, 11:01 AM
Thanks for that Teebonesy - I was waiting for your run down :)

There's a couple of things I don't agree with though. I didn't find the alien biology or culture to be silly in the slightest. It's very much bizarre and, well, alien to us, but to my mind it's not that much of a stretch of the imagination. And the way the culture and spirituality links so closely with the biology - I'd say this fictional culture is probably less silly than most of the cultures from earth, past and present :p

If you want some really weird xenobiology, Orson Scott Card is your man.


What I did think silly:

When the animals all rose up and started fighting the soldiers because Eywa told them to. But then as I was starting to get annoyed with that part, it struck me that Eywa does actually exist. The links exist. Not to mention that the film opens up with some pretty strong messianic themes - hell, what kind of messiah are you if you can't perform miracles?



I also don't think that this film was primarily an experience. Obviously it has that too and I still encourage people to get their butts down to the cinema to see it. But I don't think that taking away the full experience with the 3D etc. will detract from the film, on subsequent viewings. I'm glad to have had that experience and I'll be seeing this again at the cinema, but I'll also have the blu ray pre-ordered. It won't be the same I know, but this film is so much more than visuals and hype, so in a strange way I even look forward to the home viewing as well.

supersickie
12-19-2009, 12:12 PM
Great write up, dude. Going to try my hardest to get to an Imax this weekend. Now sure how I'm going to do it, but I think it must be done!

Teebonesy
12-19-2009, 06:04 PM
Thanks for that Teebonesy - I was waiting for your run down :)

There's a couple of things I don't agree with though. I didn't find the alien biology or culture to be silly in the slightest. It's very much bizarre and, well, alien to us, but to my mind it's not that much of a stretch of the imagination. And the way the culture and spirituality links so closely with the biology - I'd say this fictional culture is probably less silly than most of the cultures from earth, past and present :p

It wasn't the ideas themselves that made us giggle so much - I think it was the way in which they were revealed. I'll give you a few of my favorite examples.

The camera is showing the intel on a computer screen, lots of digital information and aerial footage of Pandora. It zeroes in on an interesting glowing willow tree. Out of the blue, with no prior examples whatsoever, Sigourney Weaver suddenly has a voice-over, proclaiming with much gravity: "THE TREE OF SOULS..." And the audience just burst out into giggles.

Another was toward the end, when Sully's rounding up the tribes. Again, we don't have the backstory on Pandora, so when he's listing all the tribes of all the different regions, there is a distinctive "South-Park-esque" humor to it. "The horse tribes of the great fire plains. The warriors of the great diamond sea." etc... I'm making up names as I don't recall what was in the movie, but it was very much at least as entertaining as these. The point is that they're quite arbitrary. They could be anything, as it has no bearing on the plot, they're just alien places that we have nothing to do with and don't really even see in the movie. So when he's firing off a list of these exotic places with fantastic names, again, the giggle fits commenced.

That prayer ceremony too, with the hundreds of Na'Vi gyrating in unison while chanting. Not many were giggling - I looked to the side to see if anyone was, and sure enough caught the eye of a buddy two seats down who was in hysterics.

There weren't too many particularly original "alien" ideas - most of it was a bit of an alien twist on a very familiar idea. The Na'Vi are obviously indigenous Americans. The little helicopter twirly bugs are clearly our own slow-crawling leaf bugs... but with glowy helicopter twirlies.

The exception is the "bonding" concept, which is totally alien, and something I thought was absolutely fantastic. It gives you the idea that the Na'Vi have achieved total equilibrium with their planet and have maintained that equilibrium for untold ages, enough to actually evolve together with other terrestrial life.

I don't know, for me I don't think I actually want to see this movie at home. I'm going to keep it for the 3d theaters. I'll surely buy the blu ray for the deleted scenes and whatever commentaries or features are on board, but I don't think I'm going to want to watch it. I'm hoping, and somewhat expecting, that imax theaters at least are going to bring Avatar back occasionally, maybe around christmas time, and I can make something of a tradition out of going to see it.

KoRnDawwg
12-19-2009, 08:58 PM
I saw it today in 3D. Best film I've seen in a long, long time.

Right up there with The Dark Knight in my opinion :p

chezhead
12-20-2009, 02:42 AM
I saw it, and didn't like it TOO MUCH. 7.1643724689627945/10.
It just wasn't that good.

Astrosimi
12-20-2009, 05:47 AM
Wow. Guys, WOW! This didn't just lived up to the hype. This beat the hype to within an inch of it's life with a palm frond. I mean, WOW. Best movie of the year. Maybe more, surely, but I'm not sure. I'm mindblown.

I mean, I agree with Robert Eger; the basis was cliche, but the way the movie progressed, it became something else... something not only new but revolutionary. I can honestly say to Jame that his 10 years of work have paid off beautifully.

This is not, in my opinion, the next step in movies. It is more of a restoration, a salvation, a reminder of what we can accomplish as filmmakers. For one, the movie sent it's message perfectly. I felt the movie. I felt rage, I felt sympathy, I felt sorrow, I felt like I was part of the movie. I guess that's what they call an experience. And to be honest, I was consumed by it.

If there was something wrong with this movie, which I doubt there was, I couldn't have noticed. And when you accomplish that, then, gentlemen, you have made a TRUE movie.

Spider-Jew
12-20-2009, 07:05 AM
Man, this was a great movie! Just saw it in IMAX 3D! Well worth it...everyone should see it this way. Did anyone else get a Fern Gully vibe at some points lol? Man, the movie was awesome.

Fertile Decline
12-20-2009, 09:50 AM
The mix of lameness in the dialogue with the awesome scenery and visuals makes me want to see this movie in a weird way...

mrsupercomputer
12-20-2009, 01:24 PM
I saw the movie in 3D last night with my wife and I had a really nice time. I don't think it's the most super awesome movie that will change everything though. It was fun, but pretty cheesy at times. I found some of the dialogue to be pretty lame, the main baddy was extremely silly, and the story was nothing new. Now, this doesn't mean I didn't enjoy it, because I really did. It was pure spectacle and a lot of fun to watch.

supersickie
12-20-2009, 01:28 PM
The mix of lameness in the dialogue with the awesome scenery and visuals makes me want to see this movie in a weird way...

Or maybe you want to see it because you're part of a group that is quickly being outnumbered. Next, you'll tell me that you thought Terminator looked ridiculous. Give in, people; it's okay to like a visual masterpiece.

Leather-Monkey
12-20-2009, 02:29 PM
I saw it last night!

I missed the train I planned on getting, got the next one, went to get tickets for the 3:30 showing and then found out they'd sold out. So I reserved tickets for the 7:30 showing and played mini-golf for 5 hours. What a day...

But totally worth it! This film is amazing (especially in 3D)! I've branded it my 2nd favourite film EVER - Terminator 2 being my #1.

I'm more of a visuals person than someone looking for an amazing story. The plot was very predictable at times, however at one point I thought the film had finished, then it went on for another hour! But to look at, this film is amazing. I'm pre-ordering the Blu-ray!

hilightnotes
12-20-2009, 05:02 PM
For anyone who saw this, how long in advance do you think you need to get to the theatre to secure tickets, at a major IMAX 3D Theatre?

Leather-Monkey
12-20-2009, 05:54 PM
For anyone who saw this, how long in advance do you think you need to get to the theatre to secure tickets, at a major IMAX 3D Theatre?

At least 1 hour, the line builds up really quickly! At one minute I was waiting at the front with no one behind me, then I turn around and there's a 100 people there! :eek:

Astrosimi
12-20-2009, 06:02 PM
True. An hour is sufficient, but to get truly ace seats maybe get there an extra 10 minutes earlier than that.

rtm223
12-20-2009, 07:49 PM
I'm more of a visuals person than someone looking for an amazing story. The plot was very predictable at times, however at one point I thought the film had finished, then it went on for another hour!

I honestly was unsure which way the film was going to go the first time round. I thought that it would end up with the Na'vi driving the humans off pandora but for a while I couldn't convince myself that was what was going to happen - got really tense for me for a while lol!

Incinerator22
12-20-2009, 09:42 PM
Funny teeb... The reasons why you like it are the reasons that annoyed the crud outta me.

I hated Eywa and all the retarded physic defying flips. I didn't really like the plot either, then again that's too much of an opinion. The aliens were all insanely creative, and the more aliens that were brought in the more I was loving the movie. But at the end when all the aliens were fighting for "Ewya", it just seemed like repetition to me. I really don't understand how a movie can be so amazing and yet suck so hard. lol

Fertile Decline
12-20-2009, 11:14 PM
Or maybe you want to see it because you're part of a group that is quickly being outnumbered. Next, you'll tell me that you thought Terminator looked ridiculous. Give in, people; it's okay to like a visual masterpiece.

The group of people who don't like trite story lines? That's me. I was indifferent about Terminator I'm just a little interested in seeing what the hype is about for this movie.

Hybrid
12-20-2009, 11:29 PM
i thust sa this movie :p
it whas amazing :p
i think this wil happen in the future when we need stuff
we thust Take over Planets,Solar Systems,galaxy
''its the will of the humans to Take over!''

hilightnotes
12-21-2009, 03:24 AM
Woah. WOAH.

First of all, I didn't get into the IMAX showing which was too bad, because even the one 4 hours from when we got there was sold out. But we made it second in line for the 'regular' 3D showing, so we got ace seats.

Anyways, yeah. This movie. Woah.
When the movie ended I felt like I was flying. I totally agree with Teebonesy that it was an incredible movie experience. For me, it was the best movie experience I've ever had, and although it's kinda hard to call it my favourite movie because its story isn't original per se, it was absolutely incredible and I hate not to call it my favourite movie! Everyone clapped at the end, which also was really neat because at least in my experience that has never happened.
And the story wasn't bad - it was AMAZING. It was cliche, formulaic, but so-so-so-so-so incredible. I got caught in it. I'll let Astrosimi speak for me here:


This is not, in my opinion, the next step in movies. It is more of a restoration, a salvation, a reminder of what we can accomplish as filmmakers. For one, the movie sent it's message perfectly. I felt the movie. I felt rage, I felt sympathy, I felt sorrow, I felt like I was part of the movie. I guess that's what they call an experience. And to be honest, I was consumed by it.





If you want some really weird xenobiology, Orson Scott Card is your man.

I was totally thinking pequinos (sp?) and Jane and all that network jazz haha.


Did anyone else get a Fern Gully vibe at some points lol?

I actually randomly decided to watch Fern Gully over about 2 months ago, so it was fresh in my head. And yeah, I got the Fern Gully vibe :p
Spoilerific:
I was totally thinking Fern Gully when the tractor came knocking down the trees. And then when the big home tree fell down ( :( ), I was expecting them to plant the seeds or something and it would become a new one lol :p glad that didn't happen though ha.

But yeah, I loved it, I was caught up in it, I didn't find it at all stupid - albeit funny at a few points, but in context - and I really want to see it again in IMAX 3D.


Nobody should miss this in 3D, at the theaters. Preferably IMAX of course, but you'll live if you can't get to an IMAX. :p

Teebonesy
12-21-2009, 07:12 AM
I saw this a second time, again in Imax 3D. It's incredible how well this holds up to a second viewing. You're so free to take it all in and really scrutinize and examine, and oh my god the movie just BEGS you to do it. "Go ahead. Look closer. We put it on a gigantic screen all for you, take a good close look." It was incredible. I also took the second viewing as a bit of an experiment in figuring out 3D cinematography and analyzing Cameron's technique. It was incredibly enlightening, and having seen many movies in 3D, including Coraline, Up, and recently A Christmas Carol - I've concluded that Cameron's in a class of his own, that he's honed this new craft of REAL 3D cinematography - the kind that's crucial to the telling of a particular story.

Avatar really needs the 3D. In a way, the whole point of this movie is as a tool for Cameron to "give birth" properly to 3D cinema. This movie is the reason so many theaters have been so rapidly fitted with real D systems. The storyline, the visuals, the filmmaking, everything about this movie is designed to be a sensory experience, something that would be crucially amazing in 3D.
Avatar is 3D cinema's "coming out" party. And I have no doubt that Cameron is a master of this very new craft.

And yes, I realize 3D movies have been around for half a century. Somehow they've never been more than a gimmick or an extra until now. Zemeckis can't get past the "gimmick" of it, in three movies he hasn't managed it. With Pixar movies and other 3D animated family films, it's an extra. Unnecessary in the remotest, little more than a bonus. I saw Up, tried it with and without the 3D glasses, and came out with a bit of a shrug ultimately. I preferred it in 3D as it was a bit more immersive. But that's about all I can say.

This is perhaps the only movie I've seen since Blade Runner where the sheer force of the visuals have actually haunted me. I've revisited Pandora so often, daydreaming about it even. It sticks in my mind so vividly, having experienced it through this incredible 7-story window.

Another thing that's really stuck with me is this character of the Na'vi, and the heart-wrenchingly intimate relationship they have with their planet. The secret the planet holds in this regard - These are things that stick with me aside from just the visuals. But what's amazing is that in this film, the visuals were the road by which this message reached me - without the spectacle of this film, I wouldn't really care. Instead it felt real. More real than real in so many ways, because we've become almost numb to our own terrestrial experience. We know it all. We've seen it all. What Avatar offers is unspeakably compelling to me, and I think it's going to strike a chord with a lot of people.

I enjoyed the stupid stuff in this movie as well, it's all part of an atmosphere of fun. You have to allow yourself the wiggle room to enjoy the camp, the occasionally bad lines ("unobtainium???"), and the over-the-top characters. I LOVE Colonel Quaritch. I've rarely enjoyed a "villain" so much in movies.
"MASKS!" *kicks door down*
He's a classic. Stephen Lang just absolutely stole every scene he was in.

I love the Ferngully references people here are making. I'd like to compare two animated films that are about identical themes, that tell nearly identical stories. One is Ferngully: The Last Rainforest. The other is Princess Mononoke. Between the two, 10 out of 10 times I will choose Mononoke. I think it's a magical film. It's haunting, unbelievably imaginative, unpredictable, and nuanced. Ferngully is really none of these things, and is far more cartoony and accessible. It's interesting to me that between the two, Avatar is FAR more like Ferngully than like Mononoke. I personally think that's a crying shame, and I think it's a result of a bit of a fear of risk with such a high-profile, high-budget project. Cameron knew not to push any buttons with this thing, because he was on thin ice as it was - inventing new ways of filmmaking as he went, making the movie over half a decade - these are such wildcards that compounding all of this with a risky story that would make studio suits jumpy could be a recipe for disaster, and realistically would never happen. So instead of the much darker, much more haunting and strange and nuanced Mononoke, we get the cartoon version - we get Ferngully, the accessible one, the fun one, the good guys vs bad guys one. If nothing else, Cameron has proven himself a master at creating "accessible" filmmaking, as he's following up one of the most popular movies of all time.

Nevertheless, I can't help but dream of what Avatar could have been were it to take the "Mononoke" road with this material.

Oh, one more thing while it's all fresh in my mind. Seen it twice now - and I don't do this with many movies, but with this one I think I can pretty clearly point to a favorite scene. Without spoiling too much - the banshee nest.
This scene is, simply put, one of the most exciting pieces of filmmaking I've seen in years.

SPONGMONKEY56
12-21-2009, 09:45 AM
I saw it, and it's incredibleeeeeeee!
And very sad.

Leather-Monkey
12-21-2009, 12:40 PM
For me, it was the best movie experience I've ever had, and although it's kinda hard to call it my favourite movie because its story isn't original per se, it was absolutely incredible and I hate not to call it my favourite movie!

Exactly how I feel! Maybe the movie will really grow on me after time and I'll get that fantastic sense of nostalgia whenever I watch it.

BasketSnake
12-21-2009, 01:10 PM
Haven't seen it yet but even my friend who saw it in a relatively small theater says it's very good and that you "don't notice the blending between animations and real actors". That's not what I took away from the trailer so I'm curious now.

supersickie
12-21-2009, 05:06 PM
Going tonight. Imax is out, but I will have my time hopefully in the very near future. Thanks a ton for your write-ups, Teebonesy; great commentary on a remarkable film.

hilightnotes
12-21-2009, 05:47 PM
I find it remarkable that so many people are having very similar reactions to the movie. Just goes to show how deep this movie cuts into you - it really reaches down into us for almost every person it seems.

Alex™
12-21-2009, 06:26 PM
I saw it last night!

I missed the train I planned on getting, got the next one, went to get tickets for the 3:30 showing and then found out they'd sold out. So I reserved tickets for the 7:30 showing and played mini-golf for 5 hours. What a day...

But totally worth it! This film is amazing (especially in 3D)! I've branded it my 2nd favourite film EVER - Terminator 2 being my #1.

I'm more of a visuals person than someone looking for an amazing story. The plot was very predictable at times, however at one point I thought the film had finished, then it went on for another hour! But to look at, this film is amazing. I'm pre-ordering the Blu-ray!

You only like T2 because of You Could Be Mine being in it :D

Leather-Monkey
12-21-2009, 06:35 PM
You only like T2 because of You Could Be Mine being in it :D

That is one part of it. ;)


Haven't seen it yet but even my friend who saw it in a relatively small theater says it's very good and that you "don't notice the blending between animations and real actors". That's not what I took away from the trailer so I'm curious now.

It didn't even cross my mind that part of it was CGI!

acdramon
12-21-2009, 07:42 PM
I saw the movie as soon as I came home from school. The story was a little predictable at times but I felt like I was standing along side Jake Sully (The Main charater) as he grew to see how selfish some humans can be. To see How the Nav'i so closely resembled how some culture fell that they should respect the planet almost made me shed a tear. I didn't get to see it in 3D but oh man what a feet Cameron made. The visual depth in that movie is astounding.
The enivironment popped out at you (even if it wasn't in 3D) and the animals were imaginative. I couldn't tell where the CG began or ended on the Nav'i. The charaters were immersive and fantastic. But there was one part in the movie where they were fighting and the Nav'i were getting shot down like flies when in the beginning they said they were extremly hard to kill because they're bones were made from carbon fiber. From the reviews from this site alone I want to see this movie in 3D.
Overall when I was done with the movie(even at the beginning of the movie) I want to become a Nav'i. I wanted to fight like one, talk like one, fly like one. It felt like a visual feast for the eyes, ear, and soul. It made think about how some humans don't care about what they do to get something. And how some people will do anything to protect whats right. Cameron did what I call the best experience in a movie to date (at least for me). And did anyone think that the Nav'i version of the docter (forget her name) was prettier than here human version? Just wondering.

hilightnotes
12-21-2009, 08:23 PM
And did anyone think that the Nav'i version of the docter (forget her name) was prettier than here human version? Just wondering.

I think that was an issue with the Na'vi in general... I had trouble concentrating on the scenery and dialogue during some scenes with Neytiri :rolleyes:



Also, yeah, CGI didn't cross my mind at all either. Everything felt real.

Teebonesy
12-21-2009, 09:05 PM
I had trouble concentrating on the scenery and dialogue during some scenes with Neytiri :rolleyes:

She has that effect on... on... *watches tail swishing back and forth*
...cupcakes...

Agh, what??

What's going to happen next? The movie's going to kick off a trilogy. The next two installments will be filmed back-to-back, a la The Matrix sequels and Pirates of the Carribbean sequels, and then released probably a year apart. As with those two other trilogies, this one's final two parts will probably play more as a single "2-parter" than standalone movies with distinct endings like Indiana Jones.

So here's what I see happening - It seems foolish and just plain evil to have the humans come back in greater numbers to overwhelm the Navi and try to take over Pandora. But there is one element that they've established is in the human formula that will allow them to commit almost any unspeakable evil: and that's desperation. Earth is described as being almost devoid of plantlife. It's lost all green. It's dying. and people are running out of options. So this is probably going to be the catalyst to drive them back to Pandora. Things are going to reach a bottleneck where desperate measures must be taken for survival.

In Avatar, the final battle consists of about 2000 Na'vi. Considering what we've seen in recent years in movies, this is miniscule. Perhaps Cameron's deliberately leaving some room for the sequels to "swell", so to speak.

Honestly, I hope I'm wrong. I'm merely stating what I'm EXPECTING to be the case, but my god, if Cameron has some major curve-balls in mind and is about to pull out all the stops and create something stranger and more unpredictable, I'll be absolutely thrilled. I'm definitely expecting much more to come out of the "Eywa" network, and more than likely Pandora probably holds a few more secrets. It is called Pandora, after all.

bonner123
12-21-2009, 09:38 PM
I was going to see this but I ended up seeing Invictus instead. I don't regret my choice.

iGotFancyPants
12-21-2009, 09:58 PM
Hmm I'll be watching this tonight with some buddies. Hopefully we aren't disappointed ;)

hilightnotes
12-21-2009, 11:12 PM
What's going to happen next? The movie's going to kick off a trilogy.

Is this fact, or speculation? I was kinda hoping it would be stand-alone.

Teebonesy
12-21-2009, 11:36 PM
Is this fact, or speculation? I was kinda hoping it would be stand-alone.

This is fact. Cameron's been very open about it since the beginning of his work on the project. It's an old, old idea he's had, and he's always been clear that if Avatar does well (the numbers have already spoken), then he'll follow the "Pirates of the Caribbean" route and shoot 2 sequels back-to-back and release a trilogy.

This will also serve as the model for his eventual follow-up to the Avatar series, "Battle Angel", based on a manga series about the life of a robot girl in a post-apocalyptic future.

I should point out that lately his line has been "I don't know what I'm going to do next", but he's also pointed out that you don't generally ask a mother about her next children when she's in the middle of labor, or when she's JUST had the baby.
For years leading up to now, Cameron's been very open about his plans for the Avatar trilogy, so I wouldn't expect him to change those plans now that the movie is a smash hit.

Astrosimi
12-22-2009, 12:01 AM
He better do it well though.. what I'm worried about is that he'll be rushed..... It took him 10 years to make ONE movie, so if he releases TWO of them in the span of, let's say, 5 years, they have a high chance of not being as good.

But then again, this could go the Star Wars route, which is a good one. Let's pray for the best, because if he does this right, then I'm all up for a sequel :D

Teebonesy
12-22-2009, 12:11 AM
He better do it well though.. what I'm worried about is that he'll be rushed..... It took him 10 years to make ONE movie, so if he releases TWO of them in the span of, let's say, 5 years, they have a high chance of not being as good.

But then again, this could go the Star Wars route, which is a good one. Let's pray for the best, because if he does this right, then I'm all up for a sequel :D

This is James Cameron we're talking about here. He's made the two (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090605/)best (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103064/)sequels in Hollywood history.

Keep in mind they're going to be shot as one movie and released as 2. Similar to Lord of the Rings, and the two Pirates of the Caribbean sequels. So it'll be several years before we see a sequel, but it won't require the invention and experimentation that this one took, so that eliminates a good chunk of time.

I'm really hoping that since this one's becoming such a huge hit (word of mouth will keep it strong in theaters for a while) that he'll be free to be a bit more risky and interesting with the story in the sequels. By the time the sequels hit, it'll be an established franchise with a guaranteed huge opening. Cameron will be a bit more freed as a director, in many ways.

rtm223
12-22-2009, 12:14 AM
Cash flow certainly won't be a problem, that's for sure ;)

Kog
12-22-2009, 01:14 AM
I was hoping for a sequel :D

Also, I was wondering, how do the Na'vi make babies? I mean, when Jake saw his Avatar, it had no... you know. Do they do the bonding thing? But if that was true, wouldn't that mean they would be doing it with the animals? o_0

I know it's a weird question, but it made me wonder, lol.

hilightnotes
12-22-2009, 02:25 AM
I was hoping for a sequel :D

Also, I was wondering, how do the Na'vi make babies? I mean, when Jake saw his Avatar, it had no... you know. Do they do the bonding thing? But if that was true, wouldn't that mean they would be doing it with the animals? o_0

I know it's a weird question, but it made me wonder, lol.

When the Na'vi is in the incubator, people are place at strategic positions, or the angle is shot specifically, so that you can't see between its legs. So you have to assume its still there :p

Although, the tail was referenced to be a sensory organ.

supersickie
12-22-2009, 02:46 AM
This is James Cameron we're talking about here. He's made the two (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0090605/)best (http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0103064/)sequels in Hollywood history.

Keep in mind they're going to be shot as one movie and released as 2. Similar to Lord of the Rings, and the two Pirates of the Caribbean sequels. So it'll be several years before we see a sequel, but it won't require the invention and experimentation that this one took, so that eliminates a good chunk of time.

I'm really hoping that since this one's becoming such a huge hit (word of mouth will keep it strong in theaters for a while) that he'll be free to be a bit more risky and interesting with the story in the sequels. By the time the sequels hit, it'll be an established franchise with a guaranteed huge opening. Cameron will be a bit more freed as a director, in many ways.

This is what will keep people coming back. The framework has been laid and people will know what to expect... or they think they will. That's where Cameron will really blow us away.

Just got back and I really can't say anything that hasn't already been said here. Experience? Check. Exhausted? Check. Eager to talk the wife into seeing it again tomorrow night? Check.

I hadn't seen a film in 3D before tonight and it's really nice to be able to say that. Obviously, I have nothing to compare it to, but that's all the more glorious in my opinion. The inclusion of depth perception due to the 3D effect is what really threw me for a loop, but I was all the more excited at seeing something so brilliant right in front of me.

Cameron's detail and vision go on for what seems like days rather than nearly three hours. As it stands, I don't know that I ever want to see a plain ol' 2D movie ever again. Of course, that's assuming everything will be done with Cameron's standards in mind. And - that said - no one even compares to where Cameron's at right now with Avatar. That said, what I wouldn't give to see The Abyss and/or Aliens done the same way. :)

Teebonesy, dude, I just want to call you up on the phone and talk your ear off on this one. Believe it or not, I have no close friends that have seen the film yet or are even remotely excited to see it. Painful really. Just got off of the phone with my dad; he tells me he's "just not into that fantasy stuff". What?! Even my best friend just doesn't seem to get it; he's ready and willing to accept the opinions of unknowns who are declaring the film to be devoid of anything resembling quality while I'm over here shouting about how he HAS to see this film!

At the very least, maybe your girlfriend can talk to my wife and convince her it's worth her time tomorrow night? ;)

Littlebigdude805
12-22-2009, 05:20 AM
Just saw this last night and one of my first thoughts was AWESOME and i swear that was the only movie ive seen that got a standing ovation. Second thought was "ahh dang my butt is sore" yea it was a long movie but i loved every second of it, there was about 3 points in the movie that felt like they were the end and me and my friend would always lean over and say "nonono, that can NOT be the end, i will cry if it is". On the way home we couldnt stop talking about it. There is almost no way to describe in full detail this movie to others, i dont even bother anymore, i just say "You gotta see it".

thefrozenpenquin
12-22-2009, 08:00 AM
...


...


...


Wow...

I was looking forward to it. And then I saw the trailers. I really didn't want to see it after after the trailers. I read a review online and decided to see it, refer to the top of this post. That movie was awesome.

Teebonesy
12-22-2009, 09:00 AM
That said, what I wouldn't give to see The Abyss and/or Aliens done the same way. :)

We may not see those two in 3D anytime soon, but he has launched a 3D re-invigoration of Titanic. They're fitting it with full 3D, and, thankfully, Cameron insists on being at the helm on this one to make the depth decisions shot by shot. So it's going to be pretty time-consuming and painstaking, but what this means is that Titanic will be playing in theaters again (including Imax) in full 3D. It's one of those movie events that has 2 clear faces. The studio is drooling. Put TITANIC back in theaters, in 3D after the success of Avatar? Yes, please, we would like huge bundles of money, thank you for offering. On the other hand, Cameron has said that if he could go back and do Titanic again, it would be in 3D. He's always wished it was 3D, and the lack of a firm 3D projector infrastructure in most mainstream theaters, and a lack of a solid 3D photography standard is what kept him from doing it back in the 90s. But, even T2 and Aliens being his most beloved "guy" movies (and the greatest action films ever made), I think it's safe to say that Titanic may nonetheless be his most immersive movie aside from Avatar, and therefore the one that would benefit the most from what he might bring to it in terms of 3D cinematography. I'm excited for it, I think it'll be great seeing that movie on the big screen again, and I'm hoping (but pretty doubtful) that Titanic-haters might give it a second shot and discover a pretty incredible film that they may not quite remember seeing. Although to be honest I think most Titanic haters don't genuinely hate it, they're just being fashionable.

I have to admit - the scene in Avatar in which the "thanator" appears behind Sully gave me a flashback of the Alien queen peering around the corner toward the camera at the end of Aliens - down the corridor, as Ripley was running around the corner to the lift with Newt. And it struck me how incredible - I mean INCREDIBLE - a "scary" movie like Aliens could be with Cameron at the helm. looking down a corridor and seeing the Alien Queen coming around and LOOKING AT YOU? With Cameron's 3D chops? Pants-piddling. Or in Terminator 1, when the Terminator, stripped of its flesh, red eyes glowing, is doggedly walking down the hallway toward Sarah Connor. Freaking terrifying. Cameron knows how scary monsters at the ends of hallways are. I am praying for moments like this in the Avatar sequels. SCARE ME, for god's sake. Go all out with it. I KNOW there are some grisly beasts out there on Pandora that we haven't seen yet.

Here's one I'm expecting, and I can pretty much guarantee it. Any Cameron buff will back me up on this one:

Undersea creatures. I'd bet 1000 to 1 odds you're going to see these in the sequels, possibly in a big way. He could have thrown something into the brief water scene in Avatar, but he didn't - and this was the right decision, as it would have been overkill following a big chase scene through the jungle.

But you can bet that down the road we're going to be treated to some incredible scenes that take place under Pandora's deep blue seas. Keep in mind almost everything on Pandora is larger and more dangerous than their counterparts on Earth. And also, most of them have bio luminescent properties. Fans of The Abyss may be treated to the evil, hungry, carnivorous cousins of that movie's aliens. It's going to be incredible.

I love how I'm already assuming exactly what's going to be in the sequels, but I feel like I know James Cameron well enough at this point to call it a safe bet.



Teebonesy, dude, I just want to call you up on the phone and talk your ear off on this one. Believe it or not, I have no close friends that have seen the film yet or are even remotely excited to see it. Painful really. Just got off of the phone with my dad; he tells me he's "just not into that fantasy stuff". What?! Even my best friend just doesn't seem to get it; he's ready and willing to accept the opinions of unknowns who are declaring the film to be devoid of anything resembling quality while I'm over here shouting about how he HAS to see this film!

At the very least, maybe your girlfriend can talk to my wife and convince her it's worth her time tomorrow night? ;)

Hah, I know what you mean. I have a couple of close friends who were in the boat with me. Following this movie for years, ready to do whatever it took to be there first, and with the best seats in the house. But everyone else I know is beyond skeptical, many of them even viciously opposed to the movie and everything (they think) it stands for.

And a part of me feels guilty because in a way I am kind of saying that yes, it is possible to support everything in a movie on the promise of spectacle and visuals and effects, because these are the things that hold up every single piece of this movie. Everything is dependent on them.

So what are the REAL industry repercussions of this movie going to be?

The easiest answer is, we can expect more filmmakers to try it. This is going to be mixed news in the long run. Steven Spielberg and Peter Jackson are already collaborating on Tin Tin, which will come out in a couple of years. They both visited Cameron while he was filming Avatar to learn what he had developed. I'm very cautious about this movie, VERY CAUTIOUS, but excited to see what comes out of it. At this point in time, the only filmmaker I trust with this "thing" (Pandora's Box, it may turn out to be) is the creator, the unleasher, the discoverer himself, James Cameron.

I'm far more worried by the prospect of seeing a ton of movies coming out that attempt to recreate this, but with a far lower watermark for quality and immersive realism. Remember post-Matrix movies? Every single action movie that came out following The Matrix - and I believe there were far more than usual - suddenly began to follow bullets around in slow motion, to zoom around in slow motion during the intense sequences. This is still going on today. I want to hug James Cameron for not pinning his camera to an arrow or a bomb as it flies through Pandora to its target. Never once. The filmmaking in Avatar, the movie being a bloated, massive, hulking beast of thing, is actually quite classy. Cameron knows how to use the language amazingly well.

And the fact is, thanks to the push toward Avatar, an impressive percentage of screens across the country are now fully equipped with 3D. So it's here to stay, clearly, and at the very least we're going to be seeing a lot more movies in 3D on a regular basis in the years to come, more than just animated films and family films.

The upshot to these worries is that, perhaps people will demand more of the kind of 3D crud we're seeing come out of Robert Zemeckis and even Tim Burton. Okay, I may be calling "crud" on Alice in Wonderland prematurely, but I just watched the new trailer, and it's silly - there are no fewer than 3 shots in which some object or another is gimmickly, comically hurled into the camera lens. "It's 3D, so it's time to start doing real 3D cinematography. Throw some crap at the lens, it'll make the audience jump."

OR, rather than stick crap in the audience's faces and call it 3D, create real depth. Cameron often puts his characters in the foreground, and allows the many layers of background to consist of the scenery itself. So it doesn't feel like the movie is sticking out at you, as the "3D movie" cliche often depicts - instead you get the idea that you're peering through a window or portal into a deep world on the other side of the screen. He doesn't shoot every single shot in a strained effort to utilize the full depth in one visual - he keeps these for special occasions. Some shots are straight on and contain almost zero 3D effect. These same shots in a Zemeckis movie would contain some arbitrary object hovering, pointing, sticking into the audience's face. It appears Tim Burton is following the Zemeckis school of 3D filmmaking.
It's the difference between class and gimmickry. Burton and Zemeckis and others are sacrificing dignity in filmmaking for goofball 3D visuals. And this stuff's not going to hold up well over time at all. If you're not laughing at it now, you will be in years time. If I see Tin Tin pulling this crap I will be very disappointed in Spielberg. I have no doubt Peter Jackson would do this every other shot, as he kind of does that already in 2D...

One tiny example in Avatar, of a classy example of 3D filmmaking that could easily have been a gimmick - early, very early on, Sully wakes up and there's a slight blur in the foreground. we don't know what it is, is it a god **** smudge on the lens? No, the camera racks focus to it, and reveals that it's a droplet of water hovering in the air in front of him.
It's not a 3D gimmick, though the shot does help acclimate us to the sensation of focusing from midground to foreground and then back again. But it actually gives us information - we're in space. There is zero gravity. The character is disoriented, but he, and we, have discovered at least this much so far.

What comes next is one of the most astonishing 3d images in the entire movie, at least for my money, and within five minutes of the film starting, managed to single-handedly sell me 3D, with a tip included. Something that many other 3D movies in their entirety have totally failed so far to do.

supersickie
12-22-2009, 12:51 PM
Deep sea creatures?! In a Cameron film?! ;) I'd say that's a safe bet. Man, the seeds of the Hometree really reminded me of The Abyss; I guess that can tide me over.

So, how will the film hold up in 2D? Am I going to purchase it day one on BD? Without a doubt. I know it won't be the same, but there's enough meat and potatoes here to make the biggest action movie buff weak in the knees. And then there are the unapologetically corny lines that are nearly as epic as Paxton's "Game over, man!". It's got everything I want. :)

Incinerator22
12-24-2009, 05:56 AM
I just realised how many 3D movies are in theaters, movies that I might see without even realising they have 3D versions. But most of the previews were of movies that didn't really need to be in 3D, so I wouldn't be surprised if in a decade 3D movies become more popular than 2D...

Kern
12-24-2009, 01:28 PM
Best movie I've seen in a while, maybe ever, I loved the story, loved the 3d depth of it all; but most of All was the brilliant creatures,

One quip; at the begining the commander said that the na'vi were extremely difficult to kill, yet the get mown down in the battle scene?

thefrozenpenquin
12-25-2009, 10:39 PM
50 cal can rip through alot

supersickie
12-26-2009, 01:16 PM
Best movie I've seen in a while, maybe ever, I loved the story, loved the 3d depth of it all; but most of All was the brilliant creatures,

One quip; at the begining the commander said that the na'vi were extremely difficult to kill, yet the get mown down in the battle scene?

I think Quaritch was referring to their agility and speed more than anything else. If you can hit it, it'll probably die. If you can hit it.

rtm223
12-26-2009, 03:02 PM
BOne quip; at the begining the commander said that the na'vi were extremely difficult to kill, yet the get mown down in the battle scene?


I think Quaritch was referring to their agility and speed more than anything else. If you can hit it, it'll probably die. If you can hit it.

He's says that directly after saying how their bones are reinforced. No mention of agility whatsoever. The implication as far as I was concerned was that they were tough and resilient. I also thought this was bizarre that he mentioned this and then they were dropping like flies...

Kern
12-26-2009, 03:05 PM
I loved the creatures in it especially the panther thing and the last shadow

Yarbone
12-27-2009, 12:48 AM
Omg, I think this is the best movie i've ever seen. Well... I really feel like it is right now, because it was just an awesome experience.

+3D was awesome very subtle yet effective... or something >.<
+Story
+best of all: Pandora with all its creatures and vegetation (It's so beatiful, I wish it existed for real :3 )

- I'm so confused by it's awesomeness, that i can't think of any real cons :D

So yeah... 3D at it's best, and movies at it's best.

Seriously though, with all my heart, I think this is the best movie I've ever seen.


... :D

Incinerator22
12-27-2009, 01:33 AM
The thanator is awesome :D

When Cameran was asked about what it would be, he said something that could eat the alien queen for breakfast XD!

AbstractFlesh
12-27-2009, 07:47 AM
Omg, I think this is the best movie i've ever seen. Well... I really feel like it is right now, because it was just an awesome experience.

+3D was awesome very subtle yet effective... or something >.<
+Story
+best of all: Pandora with all its creatures and vegetation (It's so beatiful, I wish it existed for real :3 )

- I'm so confused by it's awesomeness, that i can't think of any real cons :D

So yeah... 3D at it's best, and movies at it's best.

Seriously though, with all my heart, I think this is the best movie I've ever seen.


... :D

You just summed up what I was going to say :p I just saw it last night and it is my most favorite movie,next to 2012.

Alex™
12-27-2009, 11:54 AM
saw it yesterday... I was.. ok i guess. But best film ever? Nope. One of my favorite films? Nope.

acdramon
12-27-2009, 09:45 PM
So here's what I see happening - It seems foolish and just plain evil to have the humans come back in greater numbers to overwhelm the Navi and try to take over Pandora. But there is one element that they've established is in the human formula that will allow them to commit almost any unspeakable evil: and that's desperation. Earth is described as being almost devoid of plantlife. It's lost all green. It's dying. and people are running out of options. So this is probably going to be the catalyst to drive them back to Pandora. Things are going to reach a bottleneck where desperate measures must be taken for survival.

In Avatar, the final battle consists of about 2000 Na'vi. Considering what we've seen in recent years in movies, this is miniscule. Perhaps Cameron's deliberately leaving some room for the sequels to "swell", so to speak.

Honestly, I hope I'm wrong. I'm merely stating what I'm EXPECTING to be the case, but my god, if Cameron has some major curve-balls in mind and is about to pull out all the stops and create something stranger and more unpredictable, I'll be absolutely thrilled. I'm definitely expecting much more to come out of the "Eywa" network, and more than likely Pandora probably holds a few more secrets. It is called Pandora, after all.
Cameron actuallly said if AVATAR gets big enough he will make sequels on other planets besides Pandora! It will be intriging to see if Jake Sully will be a cameo in other sequels or another main charater and how will other aliens look like.

Teebonesy
12-28-2009, 08:03 AM
Here's a really interesting read for those who want to take the plunge - this is a breakdown of the old long-form treatment for Avatar, back when it was known as "Project 880".

It reveals a more fleshed-out universe, with far more backstory and everything is much less black-and-white.

From the article:

- Earth and its environmental problems are explored
- We see Josh Sully's Avatar being born
- It's revealed the Avatar program exists to train Na'vi to be an indigenous workforce for the Corporation, since it's so expensive to send human workers
- There are more humans, including a bioethics officer on the take, a video journalist, a head of the Avatar program and a second military dickwad
- There is an Avatar controller who is burnt out because his Avatar died with him in it. He committed Avatar suicide because he had fallen in love with a Na'vi girl who had been killed by the military
- The Avatars have a Na'vi guide named N'Deh, who is sleeping with Grace
- Grace survives the soul transfer
- Josh Sully gains the Na'vi trust by being a member of the community. He also excels in a major hunt
- Josh Sully shows his leadership not by taming a dragon but by leading a raid on Hell's Gate to rescue prisoners
- Josh Sully isn't the only Na'vi to ride a big dragon
- Pandora is a living entity and it sees the humans as a virus; it has been mobilizing the plants and animals to attack all along because it wanted to force the humans out
- There is no unobtainium beneath Hometree. The military just wants to wipe out the local Na'vi to send a message to all the tribes that they must be obeyed.
- Some of the humans and the Avatar controllers rise up in the final big battle
- Josh Sully tells the Earth that Pandora will give any humans that return a disease that will wipe out humanity

Check out the breakdown here: PROJECT 880: THE AVATAR THAT ALMOST WAS (http://chud.com/articles/articles/21969/1/PROJECT-880-THE-AVATAR-THAT-ALMOST-WAS/Page1.html)

Kern
12-28-2009, 12:20 PM
What's everyones favourite creatures? Personally I like all of them but if I were to choose it would be a toss up between the thanator, the hammerhead bison and the toruk.

supersickie
12-28-2009, 03:10 PM
Read through the entire write-up from Chud. Makes me sad that we didn't get to see more of that good stuff. Makes me think though that Cameron was just saving a lot of stuff for the sequels. I have every confidence, as we've discussed, that the sequel(s) will pack an even bigger punch than Avatar.

ryryryan
12-28-2009, 04:29 PM
saw this in IMAX 3D the other day... it was awesome! And today I saw Sherlock Holmes lol.

Yarbone
12-29-2009, 05:34 PM
What's everyones favourite creatures? Personally I like all of them but if I were to choose it would be a toss up between the thanator, the hammerhead bison and the toruk.

I like the little pink reddish salamander most.
You know, the one that floats by rotating, 'cause it has this rotor thing on it's back :hero:

Dexiro
12-29-2009, 07:07 PM
Just went to see this and it's just about the greatest film i've ever seen! o_O

I ruined the immersion for myself if anything by trying to figure out how they managed the animating but then suddenly massive chunks of the film just flashed before me.
Without sounding too cheesy i felt a massive emotional attachment to the characters, as intended, but moreso than i ever had with any other film.
Hell it made me feel sad about an ordinary tree falling down, nevermind how it felt when they took out the really big one xD

The buzz is already wearing thin thanks to an alcoholic old lady that followed me and my friends home, but i can still quite confidently say that this was by far the best film i've seen yet ^^

Alex™
12-30-2009, 02:23 PM
I like the little pink reddish salamander most.
You know, the one that floats by rotating, 'cause it has this rotor thing on it's back :hero:

Yeah, they were pretty cool :P

Snrm
12-31-2009, 06:22 AM
i just saw it, it was pretty good.
Funny thing is this has actually happened in real life sorta. All the indians in the Americas were killed :o

rtm223
12-31-2009, 09:14 AM
Funny thing is this has actually happened in real life sorta. All the indians in the Americas were killed :o

Ahhh yes, because that is the only time in history when a more powerful civilisation has attempted to subjugate a weaker one for land / resources / teh lulz. :rolleyes:

Obviously for people in America the parallel closest to heart is that of the Native Americans, but you can equally well draw parallels with the rest of the British Empire - I mean the whole thing is a mining operation, the goal is to obtain natural resources for profit. There are countless other examples as well throughout history.

What I wonder though... Whats-his-name wears what looks like a big feather headdress, but where did the feathers come from?

Yarbone
12-31-2009, 09:44 AM
What I wonder though... Whats-his-name wears what looks like a big feather headdress, but where did the feathers come from?

Well, we obviously haven't seen all creatures on pandora yet.

but, yeah... nice notice. :D

Kern
12-31-2009, 09:51 AM
What I wonder though... Whats-his-name wears what looks like a big feather headdress, but where did the feathers come from?

that would be Eytucan the leader of the Omaticaya,

but i agree with Yarbone we havent seen them all yet

rtm223
12-31-2009, 10:04 AM
Oh yeah, it also just occurred to me that netyri's spacers for her flesh tunnels seem to be made of metal, rather than wood or bone as one might expect...

Yarbone
12-31-2009, 11:06 AM
hmm.... maybe it's made of stone! :hero:

or... like the skin of a thanator, 'cause it's all shiny and stuff.
There are a lot of possibilities. so, yeah.

EDIT:
http://cm1.theinsider.com/thumbnail/400/322/cm1.theinsider.com/media/0/576/93/Zoe-Saldana-Avatar.jpg

ok, nevermind stone >.>

Teebonesy
12-31-2009, 06:18 PM
Ahhh yes, because that is the only time in history when a more powerful civilisation has attempted to subjugate a weaker one for land / resources / teh lulz. :rolleyes:

Obviously for people in America the parallel closest to heart is that of the Native Americans, but you can equally well draw parallels with the rest of the British Empire - I mean the whole thing is a mining operation, the goal is to obtain natural resources for profit. There are countless other examples as well throughout history.

It's definitely not a stretch to imagine humans, especially desperate humans, doing things as atrocious as blowing up Hometree.

But there's definitely an on-the-nose deliberate text here for the American natives and their violent subjugation. The movie even had a trail-of-tears (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_tears)scene! I really think it would have benefitted from a bit more nuance and a bit less Dances-With-Wolves.

We had a bit of a joke when we were first watching it, in the end, when the navi are ushering the humans back onto their ships and kicking them off Pandora - we looked at each other and said "wait... I don't remember that part happening! Remind me to check my history books when we get back home."

One part I caught on my second viewing - did anyone notice the "communal love" that was going on during Sully's first night sleeping in Hometree? He's curling up in his little leaf-pod, and somewhere down on a platform below him is a little bit of a cuddle-nest. It's about 6 or so Navi all on a platform together, and two of them are getting very, very... umm... snuggly. Gives you a picture of a very "open" type of society that they have.
Sounds like fun.

*signs up for Avatar program*

Question: Is there such thing as a fat Navi??

rtm223
12-31-2009, 06:44 PM
It's definitely not a stretch to imagine humans, especially desperate humans, doing things as atrocious as blowing up Hometree.

But there's definitely an on-the-nose deliberate text here for the American natives and their violent subjugation. The movie even had a trail-of-tears (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Trail_of_tears)scene!

It also had the companies subjugating the natives for mining of natural resources, as the British did in africa. I'm not denying there are links with native americans, but I think the metaphor is far, far wider than that. Hell if you want, you can draw similarities with Missionaries attempting to convert tribes to Christianity - the scientists are attempting to convert the Na'vi around to their way of life (schools, medicine, undermining their religion). It's not just the Native Americans, although that is undeniably a strong theme and of course people from America are going to identify with it.


*signs up for Avatar program*

Question: Is there such thing as a fat Navi??

Doesn't matter, you gets a shiny new body! Is all good.

Dexiro
12-31-2009, 07:05 PM
I think there was some themes of racism in there :p
It seems really similar to when slavers went to Africa, they saw the Africans and assumed they were savage and primal just because they didn't understand their way of life.

It's kind of the same with the Navi, they were probably a lot smarter than the humans but the humans were still trying to offer them education because they didn't understand their way of life.

Maybe i'm just pointing out the obvious here :p

Snrm
12-31-2009, 07:39 PM
at first when they said pandora in the begining of the movie i thought it was a preview for a borderlands movie i was like WOW make a movie out of a game thats soooo stupid but i realized it was Avatar XD

Dexiro
12-31-2009, 08:04 PM
I was thinking of Borderlands too when they said Pandora xD

I'd been playing it right before i went to see the movie.

Incinerator22
12-31-2009, 10:12 PM
It's kind of the same with the Navi, they were probably a lot smarter than the humans

I really dislike how their intelligence was so inconsistent.... Like when they were throwing wooden stocks at the giant warship's reinforced glass cockpit. That was pretty stupid, and funny...

Dexiro
12-31-2009, 11:24 PM
I really dislike how their intelligence was so inconsistent.... Like when they were throwing wooden stocks at the giant warship's reinforced glass cockpit. That was pretty stupid, and funny...

I didn't think it was inconsistent :p

You have to understand they don't know what glass is or any other modern technology for that matter, and there was maybe a bit of desperation in there as well.

Yarbone
01-01-2010, 01:37 AM
what dexiro said.

dandygandy2704
01-01-2010, 10:20 PM
I just saw the movie, and all I can really say is WOW! I went with some guys to see it. It took about an hour to drive down to the nearest IMAX theater, but it was worth it. I honestly don't know how to describe it.

One of my friends did point out that Pandora would be an epic place to hold a rave, though, what with the fact that the ground lights up everywhere you step.

Incinerator22
01-01-2010, 10:36 PM
I didn't think it was inconsistent :p

You have to understand they don't know what glass is or any other modern technology for that matter, and there was maybe a bit of desperation in there as well.

They threw like 100 spears at it in less than 10 seconds. They should have been able to figure out that it wasn't work after the first 50 spears. lol.

Dexiro
01-01-2010, 10:54 PM
They threw like 100 spears at it in less than 10 seconds. They should have been able to figure out that it wasn't work after the first 50 spears. lol.

Desperation or panic come to mind? :p

The spears probably took a little less than 10 seconds to get to the ships anyway, they'd need pretty quick reactions to suddenly decide to stop.

blackwiggle
01-02-2010, 12:44 AM
I've watched Avatar twice now, and I must of watched Aliens at least 10 times.
The similarities between these two movies were blatantly obvious to me.
Avatar is almost exactly like Aliens, except told from the other point of view.

I was curious, so I dipped into my Alien DVD box set and re watched an interview Cameron did back in 86 yesterday.
He explained that his premise for Aliens was an analogy for the Vietnam war,and how a technologically advanced culture still could not beat a primitive one.

If you look at just a few of the main characters from Aliens you can see their almost direct equivalent in Avatar.

Characters

Ripley/Hicks: Aliens = Jake Sully: Avatar
Carter Burke: Aliens = Parker Selfridge :Avatar
Newt: Aliens = Neytiri :Avatar
Pvt Vasquez: Aliens = Trudy Chacon [Heli pilot]: Avatar
Alien Queen = Colonel Miles Quritch :Avatar

Even the movie ending fight between Col Quritch and Sully is the same as Ripley V's the Alien queen.

Don't get me wrong,I still think Avatar is a good movie,but basically Cameron has just remade Aliens

Coxy224
01-03-2010, 09:09 PM
ooooh, I hadn't really thought much of this movie from the trailers but going to see it in 3D really made it come to life. It's really quite awesome no? :)

Teebonesy
01-04-2010, 06:39 AM
I've watched Avatar twice now, and I must of watched Aliens at least 10 times.
The similarities between these two movies were blatantly obvious to me.
Avatar is almost exactly like Aliens, except told from the other point of view.

I was curious, so I dipped into my Alien DVD box set and re watched an interview Cameron did back in 86 yesterday.
He explained that his premise for Aliens was an analogy for the Vietnam war,and how a technologically advanced culture still could not beat a primitive one.

If you look at just a few of the main characters from Aliens you can see their almost direct equivalent in Avatar.

Characters

Ripley/Hicks: Aliens = Jake Sully: Avatar
Carter Burke: Aliens = Parker Selfridge :Avatar
Newt: Aliens = Neytiri :Avatar
Pvt Vasquez: Aliens = Trudy Chacon [Heli pilot]: Avatar
Alien Queen = Colonel Miles Quritch :Avatar

Even the movie ending fight between Col Quritch and Sully is the same as Ripley V's the Alien queen.

Don't get me wrong,I still think Avatar is a good movie,but basically Cameron has just remade Aliens

You're quite correct. All of these things I bathed in guiltily, dirtily, as I watched the movie. "James Cameron is BACK" is what I thought. The James Cameron I love, that I haven't seen in years and years. But I did think the same thing about Aliens - seeing the Marines in action and the power loader-esque mech suits definitely gave me Aliens flashbacks. Burke=Selfridge occurred to me as well. But I think it's more than just Avatar having a lot of Aliens in it, it's more of Avatar having a lot of CAMERON in it. You'll find similar characters and recurring ideas throughout his movies. Quaritch is a particularly enjoyable "Cameron character".

Kog
01-05-2010, 10:36 PM
http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/yy247/CogSpartan/avatarpocahontus.jpg

Hm...

Littlebigdude805
01-05-2010, 10:56 PM
It's been said that the story isn't original and most people know that, that there was obviously slimmed down to a point of vagueness, i can also go "Once there was a fight the end" and basically say all movies has the same story, whats unique to the story isn't the general plot but the awesome stuff that happens every minute between the plot progressions. oh and here

http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/picture.php?albumid=830&pictureid=10061

expect a level in the near future

Jackintosh
01-05-2010, 10:56 PM
That is great, Cog.
The only thing is I would say that Neytiri helps hime see that all things are connected to Eywah, not the circle of life :D

rseah
01-05-2010, 11:23 PM
@cog lol

yeah it is a great movie 3d ftw

Stix489
01-06-2010, 12:14 AM
Hahahahaha Cog, that's actually hilarious.

On another note, I absolutely loved this movie!

Dexiro
01-06-2010, 02:21 AM
I don't care about originality, it doesn't stop this movie from being awesome ;)

rseah
01-06-2010, 03:03 AM
wait what stix i thought you were gone :P

Stix489
01-06-2010, 03:26 AM
Haha I come around here from time to time :D

supersickie
01-08-2010, 03:58 PM
Avatar on pace to sink Titanic's all-time box office record... (http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/entertainment/8447839.stm)

I'd like to say I'm not surprised, but I truly am. Avatar has been in theaters less than one month and it's already more than halfway to surpassing Titanic?! If I remember correctly, Titanic was still in theaters literally six months (and sometimes beyond that) after it's initial release. James Cameron wins again...

Boomy
01-08-2010, 04:34 PM
Saw it, 3D did not work for me at all, was blurry most of the movie. :(

rtm223
01-08-2010, 04:38 PM
Did you forget to put your glasses on? :p

I've seen a ton of 3d movies and never come across any problems... I'd imagine this is a technical issue at your cinema. Did the people you were with experience the same thing?

Coxy224
01-08-2010, 04:44 PM
Wow that must have really sucked...I can't imagine it not in 3D.
It was pretty epic, but it wouldn't have been the same all blurry.. or in 2D

Boomy
01-08-2010, 05:46 PM
It was still good, just blurry, not all the time, just most of the time, went to the imax too see it as well, so it was a bit of a downer.

(Due to a condition I have my head tilts slightly, I'm guessing that's why it was *beeped* up)

blackwiggle
01-08-2010, 11:23 PM
I think you must of been watching parts of the screen that Cameron was expecting you not to at specific times of the movie for it to appear blurry.

The second time I went to watch Avatar [I agreed to go with people who had yet to see it] I was more interested in the technical aspects of this new 3D process.
I'm not a cinematographer,but have always held a fascination in the cinematographers use of the audiences predicted visual perception as a tool

From what I can ascertain,without certainty mind you,just my personal observations, Cameron is relying on the audiences eyes to be focused solely at a particular portion of the screen at any one time,the other portions of the screen are treated as peripheral vision,and will waver in and out of focus slightly,mostly on the left of screen centre,but occasionally ever so slightly on the right, almost a subtle zoom lens effect,but without the change of image size associated with using a zoom.

This effect is slow,varying from around a guesstimated .75- 1.5 sec per change,thankfully,otherwise it would be nauseating and tiring on the viewer.
[To use a analogy, think if you could of watching a movie on a TV which had portions of the picture shown in HD ,and others portions of the same screen were refreshing equivalent to a 50hz CRT display]
In conjunction with added perceived contrast of the films main characters in comparison to their immediate surrounding,this gives the 3D effect.

This effect is most noticeable at the very start of the film with the space station.
As the space station takes up more of the screen and the planet below comes into view,the audiences main focus would predictably change to the newly appearing planet.
But if you are watching the left of the screen, you will see the zooming/focusing effect come in and out of play on the ever nearing space station.

Sorry ,I just realized the length of this post.
Rant over.:)

BabyDoll1970
01-09-2010, 01:53 AM
Thanks, Blackwiggle... yes, you're right, but the human eye does the same thing and when something is going to be recorded and distributed for a mass audience, someone has to make the decision as to what will be the focus of this frame? Cue the director. I think he got it completely right. It took a couple of minutes for my eyes to adjust, but the 3d was magnificent and the amination the very best I've ever seen. I loved every minute of it and bawled my way through it the first time.

Anyhow, I agree that the storyline is somewhat predictable and not at all new, but can we agree that it's a message we, as humans, just don't seem to ever get? We have done this story (in various forms) throughout our history and still we don't learn. Hopefully people's emotional connection to the Na'vi might help it to sink into our consciousness (and consciences) a little further. I think it was the perfect choice of storyline, new or not.

I admit that I never saw Titanic and never will. I caught the preview in cinemas and those scenes with the elderly couple lying on the bed as the room fills, or the mother reading to her children and tucking them in caused me massive distress and so, in the interest of my own mental and emotional health, it's on my "do not watch" list. Sorry, Teebonesy :(

Teebonesy
01-09-2010, 07:03 AM
I admit that I never saw Titanic and never will. I caught the preview in cinemas and those scenes with the elderly couple lying on the bed as the room fills, or the mother reading to her children and tucking them in caused me massive distress and so, in the interest of my own mental and emotional health, it's on my "do not watch" list. Sorry, Teebonesy :(

Wow, you saw a preview that revealed the elderly couple lying on the bed in the flooding room?? That single shot, for me, is one of the single most devastated things I've ever seen in any movie. Titanic also has the strangest way in its first half of making you forget that it's "Titanic". During many of the scenes, the movie never really assumes what's going to happen. So you sign up for "titanic", and before the iceberg hits, you find yourself actually dreading it.

But yes, the elderly couple spooning. Spooning my heart out, more like it.

I don't blame you. For some people, being wracked during sad movies can be a nearly debilitating condition. This poor lady has it BAAD:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=h_K4mAD8xnc

BlackToof
01-14-2010, 07:22 PM
For my first film in this new (non red and blue eye) 3D i was expecting a bit more but i was very happy with what i saw.

I remember one bit in the movie where the general is breifing an room of people and the cameras at the back behind peoples heads, and for a little while i thought they were the heads of the audience ^^

Also in front of me was a kid of about 6-8 maybe, and when those euwya seeds (those things that float around the main character.) came down he would always try to grab them ^^.

ALSO!
The plants were absolutely amazing in 3D on pandora, Amazing.

I change what i said, i was exceptionally happy with the 3D!!!

Dexiro
01-14-2010, 07:45 PM
I saw this for the 2nd time last week!

It was suprisingly a lot better, I wasn't spending as much time speculating about the plot and production and spent more time paying attention to the details and it immersed me completly! :p

There was always that great moment where the screen fades out half way through and everyone thinks it's finished. I heard a lot of voices in the audience saying they thought it had finished but really it's kind of a turning point for the protagonists :p

supersickie
01-14-2010, 07:47 PM
I need to see it again, before it leaves theaters. I've been trying to talk my wife into going, but she's reluctant for whatever reason.

rtm223
01-14-2010, 07:52 PM
I got a chuckle out of this, thought some of you might too:

http://www.theregister.co.uk/2010/01/12/avatar_blues/

RottenAvocado
01-14-2010, 11:15 PM
"I broke up with my Guild Wife' lolz. That was epic. I mean, he only had a FEW sodas thrown at him, right?
*ahem* That was a great movie though. I think its one of my favorites.

rtm223
01-15-2010, 12:06 AM
Hehe, I'm pretty sure the one at the bottom is a joke, around about the point it says :


My mom always said I get too wrapped up in this stuff but ... I’m 35 and I can do what I want in my room

Littlebigdude805
01-15-2010, 03:31 AM
ROFL i had this strange feeling at some point in the movie when suddenly my peripheral vision came back and i was in a theater again, i felt sad, then amazed. Its ok to want to be on pandora but to be sad for more than a minute is just odd.

OCK
01-15-2010, 11:39 AM
I saw this in 3D with my wife last week, we were both blown away. In short, I have seen the future of movies. There is not much more I can write that others have not written (either here or elsewhere) so I will simply say that if you enjoy movies, any kind of movie, then you owe it to yourself to watch this.

Yarbone
01-15-2010, 01:23 PM
Ock!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!1

Coxy224
01-15-2010, 03:57 PM
The epic one post return of OCK!

Tell everyone, the shall flock here!

Powershifter
01-15-2010, 04:14 PM
This movie was simply amazing. And for the record, I don't think I'd have the guts to jump off of a cliff and hopefully land on a huge bird that will fly me around at unknown heights and speeds. But if I did, man that would be cool ;)

Yarbone
01-17-2010, 12:10 AM
I want someone to discover a planet where's awesome fauna and flora.
I mean, it IS possible that there are other planets that have life on it.

That would be awesome... I image there will be stuff of awesome. Alot...

That's why i think this movie is also really good: it's not absolute fantasy.

comphermc
01-17-2010, 03:53 AM
Well, I just watched it for my girl's birthday and had an absolute blast with it. I wanted to be critical of the movie because of how well it has done in the box office, but from a cinematic point of view I have no complaints. It provides a great story with some meaningful social implications and was dang pretty to look at. By the end of the movie, you truly care about the fate of the Navi people, and the climax of the movie becomes all the more powerful for this reason.

I think this movie will be one of my faves for some time to come. The girlfriend loved it too. Happy 22nd birthday to you!

:)

Racroz
01-17-2010, 04:24 AM
I also liked it but i felt like they stretched some things out just so you can get a more special effects and that makes the plot go slower
and for me that really took from the whole experience of the movie and thats what i really really hate when they try to shove special
effects down your throath i mean more than 50% of the movie was already cgi! did you really needed more? because aparently seeing
blue aliens climbing up some floating rocks is more important than the pace of the whole movie

Good, well told story >>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Any sort of special effects

but of course just IMO
if you enjoy and find important the special effects on a movie's story then suit yourself

supersickie
04-22-2010, 08:35 PM
REZ!

Out on Blu-ray and DVD today (as if you managed to not notice). Have my copy on my desk right now and cannot wait to get home and check it out! Anyone else excited?

Teebonesy
04-22-2010, 09:29 PM
REZ!

Out on Blu-ray and DVD today (as if you managed to not notice). Have my copy on my desk right now and cannot wait to get home and check it out! Anyone else excited?

Are there any special features? This I am very interested in. If there's documentary, interview, behind the scenes, commentary, then I'm down. Otherwise I just don't think I'd watch it! in 2D on my wee tv? It just wouldn't be the same, it wouldn't have the bite.

Once I eventually have a 3D tv and they release the 3D version I'll definitely pick it up, but unless the special features are hearty, I'll probably pass for the blu ray.

However! I know Cameron's been pretty disenfranchised with the "behind the scenes" trend with home video releases. He doesn't like it. He wants movies, especially eye-popping ones like Avatar, to be more like magic shows again, where people don't know how they did it and it seems like some magical mysterious method, and helps increase the mystique of the movie itself.

Which I think is a very valid point. Meanwhile there's jerks like me who are A) working in the film industry and B) have the balls to NOT be Peter Jackson or Steven Spielberg, and thus can't visit James Cameron for a personal tour of how it was done.

Syroc
04-22-2010, 09:31 PM
Having just watched it a few days ago I can honestly say I would not ever buy it on DVD/BD. Extremely basic story and inconsistent CGI made it rather painful to watch. Yes it was entertaining, but it lacked in too many areas. Especially the last fight could do with some more "epicness". It felt it bit like watching an average video game with good graphics.

supersickie
04-22-2010, 09:36 PM
Are there any special features? This I am very interested in. If there's documentary, interview, behind the scenes, commentary, then I'm down. Otherwise I just don't think I'd watch it! in 2D on my wee tv? It just wouldn't be the same, it wouldn't have the bite.

Once I eventually have a 3D tv and they release the 3D version I'll definitely pick it up, but unless the special features are hearty, I'll probably pass for the blu ray.

However! I know Cameron's been pretty disenfranchised with the "behind the scenes" trend with home video releases. He doesn't like it. He wants movies, especially eye-popping ones like Avatar, to be more like magic shows again, where people don't know how they did it and it seems like some magical mysterious method, and helps increase the mystique of the movie itself.

Which I think is a very valid point. Meanwhile there's jerks like me who are A) working in the film industry and B) have the balls to NOT be Peter Jackson or Steven Spielberg, and thus can't visit James Cameron for a personal tour of how it was done.

This is an admitted "barebones" edition, but there will be a special edition released in November that will supposedly pack a ton of good special features including a documentary. I'm extremely excited for that one too. I wasn't sure about 2D either, but it's an epic adventure through and through. Watched a good chunk of it just now and noticed some little things that I think I may have missed in theaters because the 3D was possibly detracting from the little things. It doesn't hurt that this is the best looking Blu-ray I've seen to date. A purely magnificent video transfer. It doesn't sound half bad either. :)

Such a fun film. Can't wait until Gavin goes down and I can take the whole thing in...

BasketSnake
04-24-2010, 02:02 AM
I agree with Syroc. I watched it a few hours ago. It was good but nothing revolutionary.

monstahr
04-24-2010, 04:10 AM
I agree with Syroc. I watched it a few hours ago. It was good but nothing revolutionary.You just cannot appreciate the beauty of Blue Pocahontas/Dances with Eiwah.
Visually it was good, but like, everything else, not really.