PDA

View Full Version : Million Points Point Bubble



deboerdave
07-27-2009, 03:22 PM
I made a point bubble that gives you a million points and you only have to collect the one bubble. I just want to see what kind of interest there is in this object. Right now i think its giving more than 1 million (if the score went over a million), but if people are interested in it i can optimize it for the thermo. and release it on my secondary profile.

Update: Now published

at

PSN: stonemannn5
level: The MILLION POINT bubble

RockSauron
07-27-2009, 03:40 PM
While I wouldn't do use it myself probably, this would definitively be great for super hard levels like that one by that one author I forget where you get 1M at the beginning and your score is determined by not dieing, so yeah, it would definitively be useful for that...

You hear that, silverleon? The answer to all your prayers! D:

Silverleon
07-27-2009, 05:34 PM
While I wouldn't do use it myself probably, this would definitively be great for super hard levels like that one by that one author I forget where you get 1M at the beginning and your score is determined by not dieing, so yeah, it would definitively be useful for that...

You hear that, silverleon? The answer to all your prayers! D:

>_>
I knoew you'd bring that up... :p
And yeah, doesn't seem like a bad idea, i'll check it out later.
Tho do keep in mind my levels are almost at full thermo when i finish them, so if it takes too much thermo it might be unusable.
But who knows, that might indeed be the solution to my non-existent problem. :D

comphermc
07-27-2009, 05:49 PM
Wow, interesting. I will have to check this out later. Nice work.

rtm223
07-27-2009, 05:55 PM
If it's an inverted switch connected to many brains then you can save thermo by having the switch connected to an emitter which emits many creaturesvery quickly, each of whom have (say) 10 brains, connected to their own inverted switch. It woul dtake longer, but as long as you set the max at once value to 1, you should be OK, thermo-wise.

NinjaMicWZ
07-27-2009, 06:04 PM
If it's an inverted switch connected to many brains then you can save thermo by having the switch connected to an emitter which emits many creaturesvery quickly, each of whom have (say) 10 brains, connected to their own inverted switch. It woul dtake longer, but as long as you set the max at once value to 1, you should be OK, thermo-wise.

It's not. :P

...and yeah rock, that's exactly what I told debo when he made it. That level is called "Harder Lands" by clarkdef... awesome level.

deboerdave
07-27-2009, 06:24 PM
If it's an inverted switch connected to many brains then you can save thermo by having the switch connected to an emitter which emits many creaturesvery quickly, each of whom have (say) 10 brains, connected to their own inverted switch. It woul dtake longer, but as long as you set the max at once value to 1, you should be OK, thermo-wise.

The idea behind the point bubble was to conserve time rather than thermo. If a challenge level is replayable and you want the million points at the begining it is very anoying to have to stand around and collect them. It would be easy to make a thermo friendly way to collect a million points. But those involve the player having to do something tedious such as stand some where for a period of time. After a few restarts the player will most likely just not try to go for the high score as they dont want to do tedious "work" prior to play. The million point bubble is already just sitting there and you just run through it like normal, with no time delay.

Basically that is the trade off with the thermo. I think it took a pretty good chunck of thermo, but certianly not so much that it makes it useless.

Anyways i just calculated the minimum prize bubbles needed so i will rework it from scratch tonight to see how low i can get the thermo.

springs86
07-27-2009, 06:30 PM
this sounds cool and so does RockSauron's post hmmmm..... *runs to ps3* :p

rtm223
07-27-2009, 06:31 PM
Ho hum... what is it then? And is there a way to see this beastie, at least? :)

NinjaMicWZ
07-27-2009, 06:43 PM
Wasn't it like 2 and a 1/2 blocks or 3 of therm? Plenty of room to work with, especially for the style of level that would most likely use something like this... and without any need for other points, you've got no worries about trying to fit points in anywhere else in the level (or trying to suspend them on dark matter to add to the geometry).

debo'll have to tell you rtm... I can't go selling his secret sauce for him. It's pretty much a simple "duh... why didn't I think of that?" thing though. debo's like Rainman with this stuff.

deboerdave
07-27-2009, 07:07 PM
i dont have it up online yet, but i will get up tonight when i get a chance to get on lbp.
i didnt publish before becuase i didnt want to deal with the fact my 20 slots are in use.

deboerdave
07-28-2009, 03:34 AM
Alright so i pubblished the level. its at

PSN: stonemannn5
level: The MILLION POINT bubble

i takes up a little over 3 bars.
i had it lower by trying to cut out some dark matter it uses down to only one piece but it ended up making it pop funny and making the screen/sound freak out when you collected it so i left all the dark matter in as it didnt lower the thermo too much any ways and makes its collection pretty seemless
.
so i have it as a prize for finishing the level there

comphermc
07-28-2009, 03:30 PM
Wow, very nice. And it happens all so quickly - I was amazed by that. Thanks for sharing.

BSprague
07-29-2009, 03:01 AM
Old fashion race gates is the way to go. Set it to an incredibly high number, place a finish gate right next to it, and the player is set. This is used in Plain Platformer by coasterfreak1235, and it works very well in my opinion.

deboerdave
07-29-2009, 01:11 PM
Well just made it to make it, and its pretty cool. I think by using the million points you are just measuring perfection and dont care about the players speed. Plus its still faster than a a race gate, as you just run through it and you dont have to wait 3 seconds, or have a clock sound the whole time.

rtm223
07-29-2009, 01:14 PM
Plus there is the benefit of "WFT just happend" when they do run through it. I completely forgot to look last night so I'm still really intruiged :)


Edit. Went to go look.


I can't go selling his secret sauce for him. It's pretty much a simple "duh... why didn't I think of that?" thing though. debo's like Rainman with this stuff.

Hahaha it so is. So simple yet so genious. I love it.

Sunrise_Moon
07-30-2009, 03:35 PM
Could someone maybe post a picture? I've been gone and I can't get to my PS3 right now...

deboerdave
07-31-2009, 01:06 PM
it is pretty simple, but its kinda a glitch with the emitters. I did find another cool little thing when messing with this though. When i paused it and delete all the bits of darkmater, and then unpuased it. All the score bubbles went exploding everywhere. so i though of removing the darkmatter bits, then encapasling the bubbles in some disolve material. Then you can have like a point bomb.

Hybrid
07-31-2009, 06:06 PM
nice man realy nice

comphermc
07-31-2009, 06:54 PM
it is pretty simple, but its kinda a glitch with the emitters. I did find another cool little thing when messing with this though. When i paused it and delete all the bits of darkmater, and then unpuased it. All the score bubbles went exploding everywhere. so i though of removing the darkmatter bits, then encapasling the bubbles in some disolve material. Then you can have like a point bomb.

That would be awesome. Please make a point bomb! It makes me smile just thinking about it...

CENTURION24
08-02-2009, 06:31 AM
the bubble takes up therm before you grab it. after you grab it the therm drops down. if you can make it without the dark matter the therm whould drop even more.

rtm223
08-02-2009, 08:07 AM
You need the dark matter to create it in the first place. The object overlay relies on that doesn't it?

I was wondering what would happen if you deleted the triangles of dark matter in pause, then added a new piece of dark matter. Not only would that reduce the number of vertices, but also the number of objects (each point is still probably a separate object ATM)

comphermc
08-02-2009, 01:31 PM
Yes, what rtm said. The glitch depends entirely on the use of DM. I was playing around with it, and the DM even allows you overlap different materials. As deboerdave suggested was possible, I made a point bomb, which hilariously works. I'm going to tweak it a bit to try to reduce the thermo, but it works on the premise that the DM allows you to overlap a thin layer of dissolve as well. Shrink it down, and it becomes invisible. Trigger the dissolve, which can be done with a prox switch attached to the dissolve itself, and the bubbles fly off in all directions. Not all of the bubbles survive the 'explosion', so I'm going to try to reduce the number of bubbles and ease down the thermo... I'll post here when it's done.


I was wondering what would happen if you deleted the triangles of dark matter in pause, then added a new piece of dark matter. Not only would that reduce the number of vertices, but also the number of objects (each point is still probably a separate object ATM)

Hmmm... interesting. If this works, it should create a thermo friendly super bubble...

Zhion5991
08-02-2009, 02:49 PM
That is so cool :D I'll definitely try to use this in my upcoming level :)

deboerdave
08-03-2009, 03:37 PM
You need the dark matter to create it in the first place. The object overlay relies on that doesn't it?

I was wondering what would happen if you deleted the triangles of dark matter in pause, then added a new piece of dark matter. Not only would that reduce the number of vertices, but also the number of objects (each point is still probably a separate object ATM)

yeah i had tried this before i published it. I had adjusted it so that the final bubble just had one piece of dark matter holding it together. What had happened to me was that when you went to collect the bubble. It was as if they werent all popping at the same time. This resulted in small game play lag and wierd audio glitch. The audio glitch sound like a computer buzzer noise (like a noize a computer makes when its not happy) and tripped me out for a second.

You have to make the object in two steps, so you could possibly try reducing the dark matter to 1 in the first step and leaving it in the next step (leaving 15 pieces of darkmatter triangles ... need to make 15*21=315 Prizebubbles needed for 1 million points) . But i didnt try that as i guess i was lazy and the first method that failed didnt greatly reduce the thermo (i think it went down about a half step).

... i just noticed something else this weekend. I tried to put in a camera zone and it introduced lag. I wasnt aware that the moving away from the defualt camera contributes to lag.

comphermc
08-03-2009, 04:26 PM
I noticed when trying to place a prox switch on the bubble, it causes serious lag as well (and the little wire connector doesn't want to show up).

NinjaMicWZ
08-03-2009, 09:12 PM
I wasnt aware that the moving away from the defualt camera contributes to lag.

Always... any level with alot of objects and geometry on screen gets super lag with a wider camera shot, and almost none with a close up zoom. It's difficult to control it with multiple players thought, since the players pull the camera around by separating from each other.

With the point bubble though, in a blank level, I'm not sure why it would make a difference since it's the same amount of objects no matter what angle or distance. hmm unless more of the geometry of the point bubbles is rendered differently when viewed from different angles... or possibly because the negative space in the level requires a substantial amount of processing power as well so a wide view with nothing in it is still being "displayed" - ie: the adjustable fog and brightness levels etc, it must technically be tallied in as an "object"

deboerdave
08-04-2009, 03:25 AM
Always... any level with alot of objects and geometry on screen gets super lag with a wider camera shot, and almost none with a close up zoom. It's difficult to control it with multiple players thought, since the players pull the camera around by separating from each other.

With the point bubble though, in a blank level, I'm not sure why it would make a difference since it's the same amount of objects no matter what angle or distance. hmm unless more of the geometry of the point bubbles is rendered differently when viewed from different angles... or possibly because the negative space in the level requires a substantial amount of processing power as well so a wide view with nothing in it is still being "displayed" - ie: the adjustable fog and brightness levels etc, it must technically be tallied in as an "object"


it was actually a close up zoom so when you go to grab the bubble can have closer look with the zoom in. wasnt to much but thought it would be more with multiple so just didnt use it

rtm223
08-04-2009, 08:45 AM
I'd guess that is because the deformation on the objects behind the bubble takes a bit of processing. If zoomed out it probably does some optimisation / simplification of the calc. Zoomed in you have 300 bubbles all trying to deform the light from the background, in higher detail. The pattern you get on the bubble, whilst cool, looks like it is struggling to make sense of what it is supposed to be rendering anyway. Or it could be somat else :p

siccology
08-04-2009, 07:34 PM
this sounds cool im gunna try to use it also

EDit: is there a way to tweak it and make it x100??

comphermc
08-04-2009, 07:56 PM
this sounds cool im gunna try to use it also

EDit: is there a way to tweak it and make it x100??

It automatically creates a x100 multiplier when you get it. It's basically one bubble that makes your score jump to 1 million very quickly. Therefore, x100 would be redundant. It also takes up 3 bars of thermo.

siccology
08-04-2009, 08:01 PM
It automatically creates a x100 multiplier when you get it. It's basically one bubble that makes your score jump to 1 million very quickly. Therefore, x100 would be redundant. It also takes up 3 bars of thermo.

yea thats true i never thought about that lol thanks

deboerdave
08-04-2009, 08:13 PM
i think it gives you a 63x multplier. I set it up to use the least number of prize bubbles possible to get 1 million points. The first time i tried it with regular point bubble and just put down way more than needed and it gave a million, but totally wasted out my thermomater. So after i saw it worked i calculated the least bubbles needed and used prize bubble becuase they are worth more.

edit: my mistake it is a 64x multiplier

siccology
08-04-2009, 08:28 PM
that's a good idea actually kudos i never would've thought of that

Sunrise_Moon
08-05-2009, 05:25 AM
Found it. It's pretty cool, but I can't figure out how you got it all in one bubble O.o

deboerdave
08-05-2009, 01:55 PM
emitters. with a bit of dark matter glued to the bubble so it does move. Then they can emit on top of each other.

Dexist
08-05-2009, 02:35 PM
i think it gives you a 63x multplier. I set it up to use the least number of prize bubbles possible to get 1 million points. The first time i tried it with regular point bubble and just put down way more than needed and it gave a million, but totally wasted out my thermomater. So after i saw it worked i calculated the least bubbles needed and used prize bubble becuase they are worth more.

whats the minimum of price bubble you need for 1million score then:confused:

deboerdave
08-05-2009, 03:02 PM
whats the minimum of price bubble you need for 1million score then:confused:

minimum need is 315. simple to calculate using a spread sheet. here is the excerpt from the spread sheet


value n_prize_bubbles multiplier total_value - 1 million
50 310 63 976500 -23500
50 314 63 989100 -10900
50 315 64 1008000 8000
50 320 65 1040000 40000

Bridget
08-10-2009, 10:41 AM
Ooh, this is just brilliant!

This is something I've been wanting for use in my levels for awhile.

Not really the million-point variety, but moreso just a single bubble that could produce a larger, set amount of points. Which of course the player would have to work for, if they wanted it, haha.

As it is, I made a 5000 point version for my current level, which doesnt do anything to the thermo at all.


So for levels where scoring (via bubbles) is important, this is really useful!

Thanks!

Leonardo
08-12-2009, 02:39 AM
It lags alot of you put more than 3, for now, side by side.

rtm223
08-12-2009, 07:43 AM
Why on earth would you want more than three million point bubbles? If it's for multiplayer then you aren't gonna have much thermo left for a rounded level and you'll also need a mechanism for delivering the points to each player fairly...

Best bet IMO for multiplayer is to emit the bubble, with a key on, then re-emit when the key is gone. This way you will only have one there but no one player can stop the others from picking it up.

BSprague
08-12-2009, 10:41 AM
Why on earth would you want more than three million point bubbles? If it's for multiplayer then you aren't gonna have much thermo left for a rounded level and you'll also need a mechanism for delivering the points to each player fairly...

Best bet IMO for multiplayer is to emit the bubble, with a key on, then re-emit when the key is gone. This way you will only have one there but no one player can stop the others from picking it up.

Actually, I just thought of a way to do that. At the start of the level, there is a pad numbered "1 2 3 4". When a player is on each one, four proximity switches with very low radii attached to a 4-input AND gate trigger an emitter on a piston and walls to come up very quickly and separate the players. The emitter has a max emitted at once of 1 and a max emitted total of 4. Set the emit speed to whatever will make it have one fall in each player's chamber, but only after the previous one has received points. This idea could actually work, and it would probably look pretty cool. :)

The emitting of the next one will remove the dark matter triangles of the previous one, and if necessary, a fifth one can be emitted in a basket above the players if the triangles from the fourth player's bubble have to be removed.

rtm223
08-12-2009, 10:47 AM
But that would only work for a set number of players - you'd need a fair bit more logic to ensure that with any number of players all players are in separate spots and all players get a bubble. Or did I miss something?

The simple emitted ensures all get 1,000,000 if they are smart enough to pick it up (i.e smart enough to stay conscious). Just make sure they can't backtrack after death ;)

BSprague
08-12-2009, 11:11 AM
But that would only work for a set number of players - you'd need a fair bit more logic to ensure that with any number of players all players are in separate spots and all players get a bubble. Or did I miss something?

The simple emitted ensures all get 1,000,000 if they are smart enough to pick it up (i.e smart enough to stay conscious). Just make sure they can't backtrack after death ;)

I was talking about a strictly 4-player level where points needed to be a million each, but you could make a switch that adds or subtracts proximity switches to change the number of players without too much difficulty.

Delirium
08-13-2009, 01:53 AM
dont ! I got one of those! its a compress glitch. it will offten freeze your ps3 O_o