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View Full Version : Yes, use F4F Super Space Marble ULTRA



LeastCreative
03-28-2011, 03:52 AM
Hi! I'm new here and I just made a level that I would like people to try. Its very hard I could not even beat it myself for quite some time. Its kinda like marble madness, monkey ball, or even Hamster Ball if anyone's even played that :love: except within a space theme while both top down and side scrolling elements simultaneously mess with your head.
http://i4.lbp.me/img/ft/be498d9b90c10a324b6583a626b8c8ae798827ce.jpg
http://ie.lbp.me/img/ft/d6e5696dad8555c40f0b1c5639b7e0399cfc0247.jpg
http://id.lbp.me/img/ft/22dcdc34da0d4256bf992582ceb25690b06579d6.jpg
http://i1.lbp.me/img/ft/851af5ae6590775b5586966e84202237fc63e8ba.jpg

I can't decide if its just way too hard, or if other people find the challenge presented in this type of game as addicting as I do. (though I can say I haven't found too many like this on lbp2)

Anyway if any other new people would like to try my Super Space Marble game I would gladly try your game as well. (are they even called "levels" anymore?)

Thanks!
http://lbp.me/v/zecvqc

discokrakken
03-28-2011, 04:36 AM
Hah, they're all levels to me :) Great table-top style marble game. I like the space theme, and especially the way gravity changes. I broke it the first time when I just jumped past the blueness restoration box and down the fiery hill. The second time I couldn't get past the first blue box, so I decided to go with stick controls, though I like the way you taunt people into trying the tilt controls. The camera movement kind of hurt my head a little bit, but this was an interesting challenge. Definitely try to keep the ball from being able to fall back to earth, and you can always decorate more and more until you max out your thermometer, but hey great stuff!

LeastCreative
03-28-2011, 05:32 AM
Thanks for the feedback. It was really just an experiment with the tilt part of the controllinator and some movers and cameras. (its dizzying I know but so is monkey ball!)

I keep watching people play it and yea everyone seems to find a new way to fall off haha. I'm working on that too.

It took me so much time, trial, and error just to get the ball to work properly that when it came time to make an actual course for it I was clueless! It was pretty rushed haha. I keep making it more fun and cool looking every day though. Its hard to find the balance between being annoyed and being like "agh! almost had it that time!"

And yes unfortunately the six axis tilt control is kinda lame at its very best, in any game its used in even outside of lbp.. D:
I had to offer an alternative haha. I still want people that are curious enough to try again to be able to see the whole level.

Its too bad they lied about this game being move compatible maybe that would work better.

Greenith
03-28-2011, 02:44 PM
Had a go of your lvl, and i liked the challenge of it (I went with the Sixaxis controls, as I prefer the challenge, plus its fun :) ). Only thing I could add, was near the end (where the moving fire was) I fell of around that point, and feel right off the stage, going back to the start again, not sure if this was intended though. Otherwise, loved it, looking forward to more like this :)

LeastCreative
03-29-2011, 02:38 AM
Thanks Green haha I found where i messed up and fenced in that part better. That should be just about it. I've watched a lot of people play and fixed it every time they found a way to fall off. As far as I'm concerned you have to really try to fall off, or just be really unlucky haha.

Also, I just added tons of decoration, but I'm not really too good at making things LOOK good.
Definitely better than before either way, and I made some certain parts slightly easier.

I really just want something thats fun to play, but hard to beat. SO IF YOU GET ANNOYED AND YOU GIVE UP (if anyone in the future checks this out) PLEASE TELL ME WHERE AND WHY SO I CAN BALANCE IT OUT!

Thanks!

discokrakken
03-29-2011, 05:19 AM
It took me so much time, trial, and error just to get the ball to work properly that when it came time to make an actual course for it I was clueless! It was pretty rushed haha. I keep making it more fun and cool looking every day though. Its hard to find the balance between being annoyed and being like "agh! almost had it that time!"
hehe yeah it did seem a bit rushed. Music choices seemed a bit odd too, but I liked the way you did music changes in time with the scenery changes/events. I don't know if you'd like it, but I think one of Baiyon's sequenced music pieces would be cool the space area(s). He has two tracks under sequenced music, and I remember liking one more than the other, I believe it's the music that plays in story mode when stuff is going crazy in space and they first introduce you to low gravity. I'm a fan of Baiyon after his work in PixelJunk Eden and would like to take this opportunity to post one of my favorite cuts as an example. :D Almost everything he does has a very spacey quality to it.


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bqHQBOWaEIE


And yes unfortunately the six axis tilt control is kinda lame at its very best, in any game its used in even outside of lbp.. D:
I had to offer an alternative haha. I still want people that are curious enough to try again to be able to see the whole level.
That's good though, having the option is really cool. The six axis is pretty well implemented here, not quite sure how you did it but it works well. If anything, it's really sensitive. I don't know how analog signals work yet, but if you have some threshhold control or speed control you might want to decrease the maximums or increase the minimums, something just to make the tilt a more viable option.


Its too bad they lied about this game being move compatible maybe that would work better.
Did they? Sounds like something that will probably get patched in later, anyway. I know the Heavy Rain guys didn't want to go back and put in Move controls but Sony kinda forced their hand I guess.

LeastCreative
03-29-2011, 05:43 AM
I wish I could somehow give players more of a "dead zone" that makes staying still or finding stability easier, but as intricate as they made the new creator, its just not quite that deep. That is unless there is something i've missed, or some sort of workaround i haven't found yet. the signal itself comes from the controllinator just like the x button or anything else on it, and really I would have to configure the controller itself and that's just not going to happen on probably any ps3 software D:

I have tested this over and over;
Its very boring if the ball is even slightly slow, and playing with the stick is sleep inducing..
It's very annoying if the ball is slightly too fast, impossible with tilt and forcing stick controls, which i did not design this level for.
I may even cut them out once i find a balance >:]

But yeah basically the only thing I really cared about at first was the ball and the mechanics within. The level design itself is probably 80% ideas and feedback from others, 15% tinkering after watching people repeatedly fall off the same parts , 4% "i guess this looks cool" and the last 1% is the evil voice in my head telling me I need to somehow frustrate strangers.

The tilt is all just a tricky illusion with some game cameras and movers, its really nothing too special. I can show you how to do it if you ever want to for whatever reason, or to put it simply, the controllinator can be wired to game cameras and such.

Anyway thanks for the feedback I really like the new creator and I'm glad to finally be able to make a decent idea real, without feeling like I'm trying to build a car out of popsicle sticks and strings.

LeastCreative
03-30-2011, 06:49 AM
Just wanted to show anyone that might be subscribing to this thread a sneak peak at the beginning of Super Space Marble Madness Ultra EXTREME.

It's going to be the tribute I wanted to do since I started this project in the first place.
http://i2.lbp.me/img/ft/d52452ffdbaf11a2f85098760df7a4142f965f24.jpg
For anyone that might be wondering, yes I am working with the physics of it to try to make it as close to the original game as possible, at least in segments like this.
This does not mean the entire level will be a replica though, and surely it will not be easy. This level will include bits of other levels in MM, but also jumping as well as sidescrolling elements much like the first one. Hopefully a lot better.

Really though I'm slightly shocked that a true marble madness tribute level doesn't seem to exist as far as I know, and that's half of my motivation. That being said, If anyone is good at the music part of LBP2 and would like to do something with the level 1 and 2 songs from marble madness I would appreciate it and give proper credit.

Thanks!

nachthai
03-31-2011, 06:41 AM
So I played this last night and found the level to be pretty awesome! I did have one issue though - at one point I had to hop over to a windmill kind of thing and somehow managed to roll off the back (during the race). The marble then fell all the way to the ground and then I had to start all over again. The Race timer was still running though. Was that intentional? Other than that a really enjoyable level with a fresh idea :)

The Manx Turtle
03-31-2011, 09:37 AM
I wish I could somehow give players more of a "dead zone" that makes staying still or finding stability easier, but as intricate as they made the new creator, its just not quite that deep. That is unless there is something i've missed, or some sort of workaround i haven't found yet.

I suspect what you're looking for is a scaling mechanism.

You've already noticed that Speed Scale permits you to translate percentage-based inputs (like the stick controls, and to a lesser degree, batteries) into graduated speeds for your marble. The top speed is 100%, whereas the bottom speed is 0%. This much is pretty obvious, natural, and easy for the program and the programmer to accomplish.

However, if I'm hearing you correctly, your dead zone would break up the percentages, taking it from a 25%-is-one-quarter-speed phenom to... perhaps ... 25%-is-0-velocity phenom. In other words, "don't move me until I put a little effort into it".

The missing piece of the puzzle, then, is an intermediary, between the controllinator, and the Speed Scale feeder signal.
Hmm. I'm going to need to mock up a picture for this.

(*sounds of metal pot lids and plastic bowls hitting the floor and wobbling around*)

http://i52.tinypic.com/ohi9nb.jpg

See, if LBP2 allows you to, what you do is the have the Controllinator dictate how far along its total path a piston extends. The piston is the intermediary. Halfway (roughly halfway) along its path, the piston moves a tag into range of a sensor. The sensor broadcasts a signal to a mover, with a strength equal to the tag's closeness. As a result, you gain a dead zone that is the "distance" between the outer edge of the sensor's field, and the piston's shortest retracted position.

LeastCreative
03-31-2011, 01:14 PM
I think I'm seeing how this could work in and of itself, but the way I have it set up now I feel like I'd have to make 4 of them, which is fine (I'm using an advanced mover at the moment but I think I could easily break it down to 4 separate simple movers). I'm just not quite sure how/by what the piston/s would need be controlled or what would make it/them revert to the middle.

I'm also using direction splitters, and I think that makes the analog values more like -50% to 50%. Maybe there would only need to be 2 pistons, one for left right one for up down. I'm also not sure if you can put pistons in microchips, and everything about the ball is inside the ball if you catch my drift. maybe I'll need to build some little contraption such as this far off screen.

I feel like i could use something like your picture except have the tag sensor be an off/on value and wire it with an AND tag making it so that you need an output from the controllinator AS WELL AS at least one tag being sensed, to get anywhere.

I'm also getting an idea, perhaps when all of the piston tags are NOT being sensed, i could hook it up to a simple mover with all zeros except the deceleration which i could boost up to like 10%. (currently its at about 3%) this wouldn't be a "dead zone" but definitely a "slow me down" zone, haha.

Either way I will be trying to implement this, thanks for the idea this has been more help than anything else people have said to me about the controls so far so really thanks again.

LeastCreative
03-31-2011, 01:25 PM
So I played this last night and found the level to be pretty awesome! I did have one issue though - at one point I had to hop over to a windmill kind of thing and somehow managed to roll off the back (during the race). The marble then fell all the way to the ground and then I had to start all over again. The Race timer was still running though. Was that intentional? Other than that a really enjoyable level with a fresh idea :)

This is strange I'm not sure exactly where you were. I'm trying to make it impossible to fall off on accident so any help wold be appreciated. thanks though im glad you still liked it anyway :P

The Manx Turtle
03-31-2011, 04:54 PM
You're welcome, Least'.
Indeed, pistons do not fit inside microchips. :-)

reiverx
03-31-2011, 05:40 PM
This looks interesting. I've added it to my queue. Hopefully I'll get time tonight to give it a go.

thor
03-31-2011, 07:53 PM
I wish I could somehow give players more of a "dead zone" that makes staying still or finding stability easier, but as intricate as they made the new creator, its just not quite that deep. That is unless there is something i've missed, or some sort of workaround i haven't found yet. the signal itself comes from the controllinator just like the x button or anything else on it, and really I would have to configure the controller itself and that's just not going to happen on probably any ps3 software D:


Here is a circuit diagram for cutting off an analogue signal when its magnitude is lower than (or equal to) 20%:

http://dl.dropbox.com/u/19532904/circuit.png

You can pick up the "is equal to with tolerance" microchip in my level "Zero Latency Ana.logue Logic Toolset," or here is the circuit diagram:

http://i9.lbp.me/img/ft/639c1480a21e8b70ecb10eade4986622e4fa46a0.jpg

Battery is set to -100%.

If you are using the digital part of the signal to control the tilt (you may well be), then you will need to convert the analogue output of my chip into a digital signal.
Basically if this circuit does not work for you, it's probably because you need to take the output of my "is equal to with tolerance" chip and put it into a sequencer set to positional and put a battery across its entire length. Then use the output from this battery to connect to the NOT gate in my circuit above.

The frame of latency introduced by the sequencer should not cause too many problems, but it will mean that your controls will be delayed by 1 frame when you tilt the controller. If this is a problem, Shadowriver came up with a solution - make a sackbot and hide him off screen. Put a controllinator on him. Wire the output from the "is equal to with tolerance" chip to the input of L2. Wire the output to the NOT gate in my circuit. Unfortunately no way has been found to remove the need for a sackbot - you'll just have to cage him up somewhere. :)

LeastCreative
03-31-2011, 09:11 PM
That should be ok about the latency I have another timer in the ball anyway for the "gravity" that attempts to move the ball to the "back" every fram. so that shouldn't change much I guess

The main problem?

FAILED TO LOAD LEVEL. AHHHHHH.

LeastCreative
04-01-2011, 12:27 AM
Sweet the level worked. I used your chip twice like so.

http://i5.lbp.me/img/ft/6959bc9e54d8b0a10c428f77f47612b71ae8334c.jpg

It worked perfectly! 20% was pretty ridiculous though it was pretty much either stopping the marble completely or moving it quickly in a straight line! parts of the level are made to be done slowly and accurately, so I set the batteries to 3%, and it might be a slight little difference, but it TOTALLY WORKS! It still feels realistic (to me at least) but if you really try to, sure enough you can get the marble to stop in one spot!

This new and improved stability allowed me to slightly boost the top speed too without making it any harder to slow down.

This chip saved me a lot of thinking and trial and error, and i'm still not even sure if i would have arrived at such a clean solution.

Thanks ten thousand times!

Ace29
04-01-2011, 01:11 AM
Queued. Marble Madness was the coolest. That picture you posted in post #8 looks just like it. That is some tricky logic your working with there cant wait to give it a try, tilt style.

Ace29
04-01-2011, 12:43 PM
Just finished it... Soooooooo satisfying to finally get through to the star. I felt like was five again trying to get through the original, I thought would never get passed the spinning fire traps. That part is super difficult.

I will definitely play again and I look forward to any updates or new levels with this gameplay.

Please give my level(s) a try, any feedback is greatly appreciated. Thanks!

LeastCreative
04-02-2011, 05:16 PM
Thanks! the second one is going to be a lot more intense since the ball is working a lot better.

CCubbage
04-05-2011, 12:05 AM
I love this kind of game, so I decided to give it a shot. It's a great, well designed game. I was doing pretty well, also.... until I hit some snags.

The first time through I got to the part with the spinning arms where you need to get the marble onto one of the 3 platforms being spun around - I fell, went to the left, rolled all the way down - and ended up ALL THE WAY back at the opening of the level.

I retried, and got my ball permenantly stuck in a groove. I uploaded a picture of where I was stuck (which is also the last picture at the beginning of this thread). I tried again, and got myself stuck at the same place.

After the third time getting completely stuck I quit - I gave it a happy face because I think this level has a lot of potential and it's pretty darn fun. If you fix those areas and want me to take a look again, I'd be glad to. I'm really keen on finishing it, but I needed to move on tonight.

LeastCreative
04-05-2011, 12:32 AM
hahaha this is so funny to me. Thanks I really appreciate people telling me the sticky spots I really don't get how the ball can get stuck like that, but ive seen it a lot. I have fixed that corner there and fenced in the area around the star even more, so there should not be any possible way to fall off anymore. at least around the star.

In fact I encourage people to try to get stuck or fall off. I really don't want it to even be possible.

But yea I fixed everything and it would be cool to see another person beat it. I have 40 plays on it now and only 6 besides me have even finished this level haha.

Its kind of strange you would be responding to this, I played your vectroids level like the first day I got this game and thought it was awesome. in fact, I kinda want to play it again.

CCubbage
04-05-2011, 12:42 AM
I'll give it another shot and see if I can get through it - it didn't seem that hard - at the combo points at the beginning I had a 20x score, and was going along nicely when I got stuck. I gotta say, I think the idea of switching up the gameplay between hopping and rolling is a great idea - it adds a lot to the experience. Also, nice use of layering.

Not sure if you've tried material tweaking the stickiness of the material - it could help with it getting stuck. But, you may have tried that already.

LeastCreative
04-05-2011, 01:08 AM
yea Its all metal or stone in the whole level, i just think it somehow wedges itself into weird corners, farther than it can get out... somehow.

CCubbage
04-05-2011, 02:27 AM
Well, worked nicely now! And it wouldn't stick in the area that I was having a problem with before, so that's good. You can count one more that have made it through. :)

Not super hard - challenging, but completely do-able. Nice job!

LeastCreative
04-05-2011, 03:34 AM
Thanks that exactly the balance I was trying to achieve! I cannot even believe how many people failed to finish, but still rated yay. Usually if I have to quit something, its because i'm annoyed somehow, and I take it as a huge compliment that so many still rate it nicely. Thanks to everyone and if anyone wanted F4F and I forgot to do it please let me know.

I noticed this just got moved into the cool levels thread. Does sackperson sergeant mean you're a moderator CCubbage? Thank you if that was you!

[edit] just kidding I just read how this works haha, just as much thanks though!

LeastCreative
04-08-2011, 02:56 PM
So I was just wondering if there were any people that would be interested in testing some new Ideas I've been working with in super space marble 2.

I'm hoping to have tilt affect certain moving parts of the level as well as the marble, but I'm not sure if this is just starting to be too crazy difficult, or if it really is fun.

Either way, this isn't really a game for everyone, but if you've played the old one, and you'd like to test little mini levels of concepts I want to use in the new one, please let me know here, or even better, add me on psn!

poms
04-09-2011, 09:17 AM
Wow! I've just queued it! I'm working on a marble-related level, I hope no one points me as "copier" loool! Feedback coming soon!

LeastCreative
04-09-2011, 01:16 PM
No way clearly if anything i've copied marble madness haha or monkey ball. I'm not reinventing the marble here.
In fact. If you wanted to I bet we could combine forces and make the ultimate marble adventure.

Or at the very least... haha... I could help test it! I love these games but I have 100% on hamsterball and i've played super monkey ball 1 and 2 until I got all the minigames, so really those games are just for drunken monkey target :D I have no reason to play any of those games so I figured I'd make one.

I have found very few other levels like this, but the ones I did find were pretty cool and actually still very very different concepts from mine. I hearted all the other marble games i could find, but let me know if more pop up! (including yours haha)

poms
04-11-2011, 04:18 PM
Thanks dude! Too late to test the level :p I published it nearly just after posting here! lol
I really liked your level. I have to tell you I got stucked though. I was in a place near the beggining were you can reload your health (or blue jump power) and I felt out of the land, and I just couldn't go back to the playing area. I left, but I'm planning to go back to it to try to finish it.
The part I played was very well recreated, and the ball control was very realistic.
I hearted it, and yayed it. Good job!

LeastCreative
04-13-2011, 10:46 PM
I think I found where you got stuck- either that or i just discovered yet another pinch point haha, but if you actually fell off I have no idea how or where do you think you could take a picture maybe if you ever play again?

I've been going through and editing out some corners and stuff just to drop some thermometer and get rid of possible places to get stuck, looking back the whole thing is actually a mess haha I'm still working on the next level and Its already working much better.

LeastCreative
05-16-2011, 08:04 PM
Just started messing around with some of the camera work to make the first bit a little more obvious.
But I'm still kind of new to this whole thing.
My goal is to create a level that happens in a bunch of small segments, a lot like monkey ball, rather that one large level, but I'm not quite sure how to make level emitters or whatever people do to make things so clean and pretty. :D
I'm still hoping to find someone that would be willing to help me with some new ideas or testing. just add me on psn!