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OCK
03-03-2009, 01:32 AM
A full month after 218 I am back with my fourth level, Pulse. I created 218 right after The Legion and both levels are epic, story-driven beasts so I wanted to do something a lot "simpler" that features very little speech bubbles (I know, I can hardly believe it myself lol).

I wanted to create a race-type level where the emphasis was on strong visuals, some creative platforming and a whole lot of paintinator action. Jaeyden's Starstruck 3 was an inspiration here. The level is so gorgeous to look at and fun to play so I really wanted to emulate that "feeling" and have the player saying "wow!" the same way I kept saying wow when I played SS3.

The theme here is the pulse line and the symbol is omnipresent. I wanted the the symbol to convey a sense of danger, urgency and intensity and I managed to work those ideas into what little speech there is in the level. The symbol adds a whole new dimension to the visuals as well to create some really cool effects that I have not seen done before.

The level finishes with an intense boss battle that I hope people really like. I used my rain machine from The Legion for the battle and the effect of neon rain is pretty cool. I wish I could have made the boss a bit more complex but that is simply not possible due to my thermo limitations. Nonetheless, I think you will enjoy it :)

My thermo is at 98%. My energy is now at 0%. I hope you enjoy the level 100%!

WARNING: The level requires costumes that glow in the dark to play. Not recommended to those who are prone to seizures, suffer from epilepsy or are very sensitive to bright light!

Pics:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3634/3323894265_5d03fb6a46_m.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3594/3323894547_9a43398e76_m.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3597/3324732602_4573ed327a_m.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3539/3323895109_f66c3b75fe_m.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3617/3324733148_2fa825a0a5_m.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3625/3323893993_4a54a9b12d_m.jpg
http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3581/3324731480_225c20ac96_m.jpg
http://www.flickr.com/photos/32169450@N05/3324733414/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/32169450@N05/3324733690/



As of now I am willing to accpet 39 F4F`s and I look forward to everyone's thoughts. Keep in mind I am looking for what people liked as well as possible suggestions on how to improve things from a technical perspective. Criticism's regarding my artistic vision and core design aesthetic have no place on this thread.

Special thanks to Ccubbage, NinjaMicWZ and Takelow who all tested the lvl at some point or another and offered me some great feedback.

Coreymill
03-03-2009, 02:11 AM
My quick thoughts on my first play through.

- Once I got to the part where you need to change between foreground and background it was a bit difficult to tell what to do, and I think some better guidance would help. For instance, when I got up the 'elevator' and then dropped down and grabbed the swinging part I saw the arrows on the right which told me to go left, and the two bubbles weren't enough to warrant me jumping over there for no reason since I was trying to keep my time down. However, when I jumped over the left I found out that there was gas there and died. So I went back up and went right this time (even though the arrows told me to go left) and a light turned on and there is the lever to turn off the gas. Anyway, long story short, I think maybe those arrows should be pointing down or something to make me want to go over there first and not jump into the gas which I didn't notice at first.

- And at the section where you had to grab the 'heads' of those creatures. There was a wall of some sort blocking my way from jumping out to grab onto the first guy. I somehow ended up getting by, but I got pretty frustrated as I kept trying to jump out towards him only to run into some invisible wall. I don't know if you need to be in a certain layer or something, but I can't imagine any purpose for that wall in the first place. Other than the the problem getting started in that section I thought it worked really well.

- The only other area which didn't 'work' for me was the boss. The lighting, or lack there of, makes it impossible to see where you are shooting. So, you are just kind of blindly shooting in the dark hoping you are hitting whatever it is that you are supposed to be hitting. That was the other thing, I didn't know where it was that I was supposed to be attacking him. And as I attacked I just went by the sound of something depleting in 'health' as I shot him. However, by the sound it made I just kept shooting the same area and it seemed like I would 'kill' that section but then it re-spawned and I could just keep shooting that same section because it sounded like it was doing something but I had no idea if it was or not since there was no outward signs telling me that it was doing anything to harm him. So after awhile of shooting what I think was the green part on his shoulder, and nothing seemingly happening I tried to jump over to the other side of him but eventually lost my lives and didn't beat him. I still don't know what I was supposed to do.

- Also, when people line up several save points like that at the end of a level for a boss fight how is that even helpful? I have never been able to use anything but the last one because you run past that last one every time and activate it last so you end up just being able to use that one. I am sure there must be something that I am missing because tons of people use this so there must be some way to utilize all of them which I am unaware of.

- Other than those couple places I enjoyed the level, the enemies in the level were designed well and had a good
moderate difficulty to them, only wish I knew how to beat that last guy.

Sorry that this seems overly negative in nature but what I really liked most about the level were the visuals and things which you have said you don't want comments on.

CCubbage
03-03-2009, 02:13 AM
Well, I just enjoyed it. Gotta say, this level is another fantastic work of art. Looks 100% original - I can't really compare it with anything. It's like the entire level is exploding in neon lights.

One of my favorite parts was where I grabbed the circles and it turns out there are rockets on them! I wasn't expecting that - very cool effect.

Couple minor things:

On the part where you grab the things that turn (this is a minor quibble) - the third one seemed a little far away (but it could have been a trick of the darkness). 4 times I jumped and grabbed, it pulled me up, but I was not able to stand so had to drop to my death.

Getting off the elevator near the final boss - I had a hard time initially telling which way to walk. I went to the right, and this worked.

The final boss - in this specific area a) It was difficult to aim the paintinator because I couldn't tell where the paintballs were firing. b) I had a difficult time telling what exactly I was supposed to be doing since when I shot each section I could hear the paintball hits decrement, but I couldn't tell when I was done with each section. But I ended up figuring it out so it's your call.

Beautiful game! I think everyone should check this one out.

OCK
03-03-2009, 02:37 AM
Coreymil, thanks for all the feedback.


For instance, when I got up the 'elevator' and then dropped down and grabbed the swinging part I saw the arrows on the right which told me to go left, and the two bubbles weren't enough to warrant me jumping over there for no reason since I was trying to keep my time down.

The arrows are showing you must go back after you pull the switch but perhaps I should remove them entirely.


And at the section where you had to grab the 'heads' of those creatures. There was a wall of some sort blocking my way from jumping out to grab onto the first guy. I somehow ended up getting by, but I got pretty frustrated as I kept trying to jump out towards him only to run into some invisible wall. I don't know if you need to be in a certain layer or something, but I can't imagine any purpose for that wall in the first place. Other than the the problem getting started in that section I thought it worked really well.

There is indeed a wall which pushes the player into the background layer. The reason? While testing the lvl I found that I could NOT grab onto the first creatures head if jumping from the other two layers so I added the wall. I am open to suggestions on a more elegant solution, I can no longer think straight lol.


The lighting, or lack there of, makes it impossible to see where you are shooting.

I will add spotlights shining on his weak points.


However, by the sound it made I just kept shooting the same area and it seemed like I would 'kill' that section but then it re-spawned and I could just keep shooting that same section because it sounded like it was doing something but I had no idea if it was or not since there was no outward signs telling me that it was doing anything to harm him.

This is a bug, MM needs to fix it. For some reason my paint switches keep resetting and I know others have also had this problem. However, the switch is connected to a brain (clearly visible because it is electrified) which disappears once you destroy the given switch. I also added a "success" sound effect to indicate this but maybe you did not hear it.




- Also, when people line up several save points like that at the end of a level for a boss fight how is that even helpful? I have never been able to use anything but the last one because you run past that last one every time and activate it last so you end up just being able to use that one.

Sorry if my reply sounds harsh but how is this comment helpful? You should ask yourself if there is something you don't know regarding checkpoint activation and in this case there is. When multiple checkpoints are lined up they are activated in the background layer. If you activate the middle checkpoint for example then move into the next layer BEFORE walking forward then it will be the middle checkpoint that stays activated. In this way you can choose which checkpoint you want activated. My only other option would have been to use an infinite checkpoint but I have heard of glitches relating to that.


Sorry that this seems overly negative in nature but what I really liked most about the level were the visuals and things which you have said you don't want comments on.

I think you misinterpreted what I wrote, I love to hear what people liked about my level and I praise other creators all the time.


I am looking for what people liked

When I wrote artistic vision I meant comments such as "make the level in a daylight setting"...



--------------------------------------------------

Ccubbage, thanks for all the feedback.



On the part where you grab the things that turn (this is a minor quibble) - the third one seemed a little far away (but it could have been a trick of the darkness). 4 times I jumped and grabbed, it pulled me up, but I was not able to stand so had to drop to my death.

Thanks, I will look into it.




Getting off the elevator near the final boss - I had a hard time initially telling which way to walk. I went to the right, and this worked.

This made me smile :)


The final boss - in this specific area a) It was difficult to aim the paintinator because I couldn't tell where the paintballs were firing. b) I had a difficult time telling what exactly I was supposed to be doing since when I shot each section I could hear the paintball hits decrement, but I couldn't tell when I was done with each section. But I ended up figuring it out so it's your call.

I will add the afformentioned spotlights shining on his weakspots.

Snowspot
03-03-2009, 02:52 AM
Coreymil, thanks for all the (mostly negative) feedback.

:rolleyes:

Dude you should be happy people even post feedback.. jeez.
--

Anyway, I think this level looks really cool and I plan to check it out tomorrow when me and my PS3 are reunited. I'll post some feedback too. I'm curious to see how making the player choose a glow-in-the-dark costume will effect hearts/stars/plays.

OCK
03-03-2009, 03:12 AM
:rolleyes:

Dude you should be happy people even post feedback.. jeez.
--

Anyway, I think this level looks really cool and I plan to check it out tomorrow when me and my PS3 are reunited. I'll post some feedback too. I'm curious to see how making the player choose a glow-in-the-dark costume will effect hearts/stars/plays.

I am happy, that's why I thanked the post. However I am a bit baffled as to why some people have a problem praising things that are a good in a level, I do it all the time. When you spend so much time making something it is good to hear what people enjoyed along with what can be improved upon. It's all about having the right attitude (and yes, adding that in brackets was probably not the best way for me to respond).

Snowspot
03-03-2009, 03:32 AM
Fair enough, I agree that the person giving feedback should have said what worked instead of only what didn't work. I have to remember that because sometimes I do the same thing and only post "negative" feedback...

----

Anyway enough sidetracking the topic. I'll stop posting till I actually play!

OCK
03-03-2009, 05:46 AM
UPDATE

- Removed invisible wall near creature grabbing section (thanks Coreymill)

- Removed arrows to avoid confusing the player near background/foreground section (thanks Coreymill)

- Added lighting to the boss, you can now see where you are shooting (thanks Coreymill and Ccubbage)

- Changed lighting near laser turret section, it looks cleaner now

- Fixed a problem that allowed the player to backtrack from one start gate to a previous finish gate and therefore cheat a high score (a very big thanks to Jaeyden who pointed out the problem to me in-game)

Unfortunately I am still having a problem with the paint switches on the boss, they keep resetting for no good reason. I added speech bubbles that activate when a brain is destroyed but they seem to disappear in a split second without giving the player a chance to read them and see what is going on. Any suggestions on how to fix this problem are appreciated.

Thank you to all those who have played/hearted/commented thus far, I really appreciate it.

Coreymill
03-03-2009, 06:36 AM
However I am a bit baffled as to why some people have a problem praising things that are good in a level, I do it all the time.

- I think you misinterpreted what I wrote, I love to hear what people liked about my level and I praise other creators all the time.


- You are correct, I apparently read that section wrong. I thought it said that you didn't want comments about the art/aesthetic of the level as apposed to not wanting criticism of it.

- And I feel that I must say that I did praise parts of your level, although it was only a couple of sentences. Which is why I said I was sorry for the mostly 'negative' feedback, but honestly the vast majority of the level played very well. There were only those couple 'problems' that I ran into. And if I would have understood you correctly about the aesthetics of the level there definitely would have been more positive comments about the look of the level because as I said, it was what I found to be the most impressive aspect of the level.

Sorry if my reply sounds harsh but how is this comment helpful?


- You are also correct on this point, that is not helpful to you at all. My comments about your level was probably not the right place to ask how those work, but I have just always wondered how to use them.

- Thanks for trying to explain how to use them, although I am still not sure that I understand. I tried to set some up in a level on my moon and still couldn't get it to work.

wexfordian
03-03-2009, 08:45 AM
OCK, the pics looks great! I'll definitely be checking this out. Feedback soon.

NinjaMicWZ
03-03-2009, 12:37 PM
I'm really happy with the final product, and the few changes you made since I last played it... being able to run through it on my own, after learning most of it already, and not having to look for opportunity to tell you stuff made the level much more enjoyable.

I could tell you a million ways that I would have done things differently, but I enjoy the overall look and think some of the effects and lighting are amazing. The immense glow on everything is really top notch. It's definitely a race like no other, and the difficulty level feels just right to where your performance, speed, and ability to chain point combos can be improved each time.

The spotlight section when you get to the second floor is really cool, with the hazy look. I'd been trying to make an aurora borealis for Snowfield, but couldn't find anything that would fit in the therm material-wise... but this lighting effect would be perfect at a certain spot that needs a little more life in it's northern climate. There's already a bunch of lighting effects though, and I can't add more without making the section lag up or cause screen tears :/ I would love to do it in a similar way.

Only spots I would try and touch up are the spot before the lazer staircase-box section... the first lazer, the lowest one where you have to jump back and forth between the foreground to avoid it's beam - if you opt to shoot from a closer position, switching planes causes you to jump down to your death instead of onto the platform. I'd just lengthen that one pulse platform just a bit so you can plane shift wether you're to the left or the right of the laser sight.

...and at the boss, put an invisible dark matter wall over the checkpoints, with a little bit of wall in front - if anybody's ever on their last life, they'd be extremely mad if a plasma ball flies over and kills them after respawning.

OCK
03-03-2009, 12:41 PM
OCK, the pics looks great! I'll definitely be checking this out. Feedback soon.

I look forward to your thoughts :)

UPDATE

- Tweaked fourth creature to make it easier to scale it's head (thanks Ccubbage)

- Solved the paint switch problem on the boss by covering the the weak points with dissolve and placing/connecting the paint switches on said dissolve. Speech bubbles are also activating now (a very big thanks to Ccubage who pm'd me the suggestion)

Unfortunately the lvl fell to 3 stars, a little frustrating when I know I make 5 star levels (sorry if that sounds arrogant). I personally think the lvl is medium difficulty but so far only 3 other people have been able to finish it (you guys have been playing too many easy levels lol). Oh well, life goes on.

CCubbage
03-03-2009, 01:44 PM
Unfortunately, you are preaching to the choir here. I guarrantee you no one here is giving low scores. The issue, once again, are the young children who can rate a level without finishing it (PLEASE MM, change this design!!!). As soon as you published this morning, it went into the cool levels and probably a bunch of youngsters immediately popped into it.

Also, people may not be reading the level description telling them they need glow-in-the-dark gear. Maybe a speach bubble at the beginning telling them to put it on?

Once big suggestion I have where this is concerned - before the count gets too high - if you want to do a lock-and-control release I would be perfectly happy to go in and immediately play this, 5 star and heart it, and give it a good send off (as I'm sure many others would).

NinjaMicWZ
03-03-2009, 01:49 PM
No worries, OCK. I'm a 3 star creator too, but I'm still fully aware how insanely good I am at what I do. I'm definitely my favorite creator, and the best IMO. I love feedback that helps me make something better - ex: more efficient ways of doing things, suggestions on HOW to improve something (don't just say "fix it" if you couldn't fix it either), major bugs that need fixes, something that I should have covered up etc

...but if you can't understand what full thermometer means, or can't even do what you're asking for yourself? It ain't helpin'.

One thing I think is worth noting... if your level is found anonymously and at random, I think it's viewed much less critically than if you post it on here for feedback. It automatically puts the person who goes to play it in an apprehensive disposition and critical mindstate. A random level found on LBP catches the person off guard and surprises them, to where they will overlook flaws and it might never occur to them to take a close look at something or evaluate how it "could" be done.

TJapan
03-03-2009, 08:09 PM
Hey man, i played it, but couldn't finish it. (my wife was playing with me and she sucks up all the lives on the more difficult levels) I agree that if you cant finish, you shouldnt rate, so i did not change the rating, i just let it sit at the 4 stars it was at at the time.

i read the level description, and i tried to get the glowing costume... but was that a glitch that was fixed? i'd gotten it before, but i couldn't do it again, so i had to play it with a white costume instead.

however, i'd like to give feedback on the parts that i did see. first, this place is a strobe light siezure inducing place. its pretty much the most techno-looking rave party level i've ever seen. Very cool and very different.

I personally like how you handled the speech bubbles, i get the feeling you were going for a "crank" kind of feel for the level, and it worked out.

The paintinator was a good addition to the level... it would be sweet if you could electrify the paint or make it glow though, because at points you cant see the paint as it flies through the air.

the red smoke effect above the snakes, i didnt know it could do that. it made a very eerie effect. high five!

on a personal note, race levels drive me insane. i hate that annoying ticking sound. usually for those levels, i just let the timer tick down till it stops and i go get a sandwich so i can play the level and look at it at the same time.

all in all i liked the level a lot. i'm gonna go back and finish it tonight so that i can use up all my own lives :)

CCubbage
03-03-2009, 09:07 PM
Hey, just played through it again to check the changes. Loved the changes - definately better. Being able to tell you are beating the boss is a really big improvement.

Hexagohn
03-03-2009, 09:08 PM
Hey man, sorry I was unable to test this for you. Anyway I am at a friends house and I will totally check this out when I get home. Looks awesome.

OCK
03-04-2009, 04:05 AM
Ninja, thanks for all the feedback.


It's definitely a race like no other, and the difficulty level feels just right to where your performance, speed, and ability to chain point combos can be improved each time.

Yeah I am glad you point out chaining combos because there are plenty of opportunities to do that. Right at the very start it is possible to chain a 4X combo but is by bo means easy, timing needs to be really on-point.


Only spots I would try and touch up are the spot before the lazer staircase-box section... the first lazer, the lowest one where you have to jump back and forth between the foreground to avoid it's beam - if you opt to shoot from a closer position, switching planes causes you to jump down to your death instead of onto the platform. I'd just lengthen that one pulse platform just a bit so you can plane shift wether you're to the left or the right of the laser sight.

I agree 100% and actually plan to change up the whole section. I had something different origianlly but I hit this weird bug that caused a structural collapse so I decided to change things up.


...and at the boss, put an invisible dark matter wall over the checkpoints, with a little bit of wall in front - if anybody's ever on their last life, they'd be extremely mad if a plasma ball flies over and kills them after respawning.

Another good point, this is what I call useful feedback :) I will add this in my next update, thanks.


I love feedback that helps me make something better - ex: more efficient ways of doing things, suggestions on HOW to improve something (don't just say "fix it" if you couldn't fix it either), major bugs that need fixes, something that I should have covered up etc

...but if you can't understand what full thermometer means, or can't even do what you're asking for yourself? It ain't helpin'.

We are like two peas in a pod :)


One thing I think is worth noting... if your level is found anonymously and at random, I think it's viewed much less critically than if you post it on here for feedback. It automatically puts the person who goes to play it in an apprehensive disposition and critical mindstate. A random level found on LBP catches the person off guard and surprises them, to where they will overlook flaws and it might never occur to them to take a close look at something or evaluate how it "could" be done.

Thanks for this and I hope the people who read it get it...

__________________________________________________ ___________

Ccubbage, thanks for your thoughts.



Once big suggestion I have where this is concerned - before the count gets too high - if you want to do a lock-and-control release I would be perfectly happy to go in and immediately play this, 5 star and heart it, and give it a good send off (as I'm sure many others would).

Very kind of you but I am just going to let this one fly, come what may. I can tell you that when one of my PSN friends tells me they have just published a new lvl then I literally stop playing whatever other lvl I am playing and immeditely check out there level to help it get off to a good start with ratings/heart and a tag that makes sense. It's good to know that others have a similar attitude.
__________________________________________________ __________

TJapan, thanks for your feedback.


(my wife was playing with me and she sucks up all the lives on the more difficult levels

It's cool that you can game with your wife but the lvl is intended for single player so if playing with someone else made it more difficult or diminished the experience then there really is nothing I can do about that lol.



i read the level description, and i tried to get the glowing costume... but was that a glitch that was fixed? i'd gotten it before, but i couldn't do it again, so i had to play it with a white costume instead.

Perhaps the description is misleading. You can use ANY costume that glows in the dark, there is no special glitch required to do so.


I personally like how you handled the speech bubbles, i get the feeling you were going for a "crank" kind of feel for the level, and it worked out.

Thanks for this and that is a perfect way of describing it.


The paintinator was a good addition to the level... it would be sweet if you could electrify the paint or make it glow though, because at points you cant see the paint as it flies through the air.

Is it possible to electrify the paintinator and therefore the paint that shoots out? If so, great idea and I will definitely do it.


the red smoke effect above the snakes, i didnt know it could do that. it made a very eerie effect. high five!

lol, I think you mean the glow worms. Very easy, just make the shape and then turn it into gas :)

It is in the description that this is a race-type lvl so if that would affect your (or anyone else's) rating then that really isn't cool.



all in all i liked the level a lot. i'm gonna go back and finish it tonight so that i can use up all my own lives

I appreciate it and look forward to your final thoughts. I played your Capybara lvl the other day but was unable to finish because an elevator broke. I will be getting back to it though and I will leave thoughts on your thread.
__________________________________________________ __




Hey, just played through it again to check the changes. Loved the changes - definately better. Being able to tell you are beating the boss is a really big improvement.

Thanks man, I appreciate it.


Hey man, sorry I was unable to test this for you. Anyway I am at a friends house and I will totally check this out when I get home. Looks awesome.

No problem and I look forward to your thoughts.

UPDATE

- Completely changed the laser stairway. There is now a single turret which poses a bit of a challenge. (thanks for your thoughts here Ninja)

- Tweaked creature grabbing section

I am not sure what else I can do. Over 300 plays and only 4 people have finished it *sigh*. I thought my level was medium difficulty but apparently not.

Thanks again to all those who played/commented/hearted, I really appreciate the support.

Zwollie
03-04-2009, 05:19 AM
This looks amazing Ock, I wrote it down on my "to play-list" for tonight.

Coreymill
03-04-2009, 06:08 AM
Had the chance to make a couple runs through your level again and discovered a few things as I tried to beat the level as fast as I could to get a good score.

- One is that the timing of the lights, very first thing when you start the level is really great. When I first played they just seemed random and I kinda slowly went through them. But I found that if you time it just right you can run right through them without stopping. And the two blues in a row, the one in front disappears while the one you just barely make it past appears and it feels 'cool' to just miss by such a small margin but still make it.

- The other is that the three worm like creatures. I found a bit of a problem here. As I was trying to quickly kill them I ran up close to them to try to avoid their attack while shooting at them. However, when I did this I started attacking the middle one first and the one in the front layer would come in front of me and it seemed that I would hit a brain or something that was on it and it would die without me shooting it. At first I thought this was great because it saved me time, however it made it so part of the electrified wall that is blocking you didn't disappear and I had to restart the level. I thought it was just a fluke thing at first but when I restarted the level it happened again so I was forced to restart again and then kill them from afar.

And as others have said the changes you have made have really polished the level. Such as the light in the stairway section to help you aim, and everything new on the boss. It plays really well now and I didn't have any questions about what I was supposed to be doing to kill him anymore, even though a lot of the problem before was not your fault but a 'glitch'.

Pinkcars
03-04-2009, 06:56 AM
I'm so sorry I've been caught up with killzone :( I haven't had the chance to play it yet. I'll edit this post as soon as I do.

wexfordian
03-04-2009, 08:36 AM
Hi OCK,
well I must of decimated your play to heart ratio last night as that is one tough level :)

I played through a number of times, and the furthest I could get was just after the moving platform where you have to go up the stairs to left with all the lasers pointing at you.

I'll have to give it a few more tries and complete it before giving full feedback but heres what I can give now.

PROS:
This is a fantastic looking level. A very unique look to it. Highlights visually were the red laser lines, very striking.

I thought the way you put the points within the pulse near the start was a very nice touch and allows player to try and build up combos.

I really liked the enemy that breathed fire on the zig zag section.

The changing planes part after was cleverly laid out and had a nice flow to it.

SUGGESTIONS:
At the time I played i noticed only one person (Ninja!) had finished. I didn't feel so bad when I had to give up after my tenth try at the level. What I got completely stuck on were those lasers on the stairs after the changing planes section. I just couldn't see what I was doing, where I was aiming or what I was meant to be aiming at. I'm not sure if there is a way to make the paintballs viewable but if there is I would suggest you do so as its not only this section that I found myself having trouble seeing where I was aiming.

I would also suggest putting in a speech bubble at the start explaining that its a good idea to put on something that lights up in the dark. People don't always read descriptions before going into a level and I think this may help players avoid geting frustrated from not being able to see themselves.

As I said hopefully I will have more feed back for you WHEN I finish this beast of a level.

Finally, I think this is a great level with plenty of unique ideas and once again you have made the world of LBP a more diverse and beautiful place earning a 5 star rating and a heart from me.

p.s. pleeeeease let me know how to get past those fricking lasers!

CCubbage
03-04-2009, 12:21 PM
Hey, played again a couple times last night (I just can't help myself - this is another one of those levels that's like eating potatoe chips for me):

Wex - maybe you were looking at a 2 player list of people who finished - I have certainly finished it a number of times. Getting past the stair-laser section - I just avoided the laser, jumped up to the second step and started firing at the enemy while avoiding the laser.

1. Thought on forcing player to change planes. This can be done smoother if, instead of a single 2 plane wall, you step them into the plane using 1 plane walls. So, let's say they're in the furthest plane and you want them to be in the closest - make the first wall they hit the furthest plane, then inset a little do a 2nd wall that's in the 2nd plane. This prevents them from simple "hitting a wall" and makes a smooth transition to the front plane. Personally, (don't smack me please...) I liked the fact that you were forcing the person into the correct plane before jumping on the grab-spin creature thingies, but before it was confusing because sackboy would just hit a wall.

2. (a little related to above) Right before you hit the section (let's see if I can explain this) where you jump on a platform, jump on an elevator, drop, and drop onto the swinging circle - there is a checkpoint there which is in the furthest back plane. However, you have a wall stopping you from going to the left. This could be a lot smoother if you move the checkpoint to the front plane (so when a person dies, they just jump right again) and move the invisible wall to the right of the checkpoint to force them into this plane before they get to the checkpoint.

Really, I like this level to a point where I could see myself going back to it many times. Since it's a race, the smoother you can make the entire experience the better.

OCK
03-04-2009, 12:26 PM
Thanks for all the suggestions and I will respond to them soon. Right now I just wanted to let everyone know that I did a major update:

UPDATE

I DELETED THE LEVEL AND DECIDED TO REPUBLISH. I THINK A LOT OF FRUSTRATION WAS COMING FROM THE LASER SECTION (WHICH I HAVE CHANGED) AND THE BOSS (WHICH I HAVE TWEAKED AND JUST ADDED AN INIFINTE CHECKPOINT TO). IF YOU HAVE ALREADY PLAYED/HEARTED/RATED THE LVL THEN I WOULD KINDLY ASK YOU TO DO SO AGAIN, I WOULD THE SAME FOR YOU. THANKS.

wexfordian
03-04-2009, 12:33 PM
I don't finish work for another 4 hours but will do as soon as I get home.

CCubbage
03-04-2009, 12:40 PM
No prob - I'll do it when I get off work - but don't republish too much until a few of us get a chance to do it - if we can get enough 5 stars on it, there will be more of a chance it will stay there.

Killian
03-04-2009, 09:04 PM
I've been playing your level and I've run into a problem. I've killed the 3 snakes but a large electrical wall is in front of me. Am I supposed to shoot the white thing behind it?

I feel like an idiot now. :P

OCK
03-05-2009, 01:12 AM
Wexfordian, thanks for all the feedback.


At the time I played i noticed only one person (Ninja!) had finished. I didn't feel so bad when I had to give up after my tenth try at the level. What I got completely stuck on were those lasers on the stairs after the changing planes section. I just couldn't see what I was doing, where I was aiming or what I was meant to be aiming at. I'm not sure if there is a way to make the paintballs viewable but if there is I would suggest you do so as its not only this section that I found myself having trouble seeing where I was aiming.

I have changed this section in the update.


I would also suggest putting in a speech bubble at the start explaining that its a good idea to put on something that lights up in the dark. People don't always read descriptions before going into a level and I think this may help players avoid geting frustrated from not being able to see themselves.


Done :)

Thanks for playing through so many times and I hope with the recent changes you will be able to complete it. I look forward to your final thoughts.

__________________________________________________ _____

Ccubbage, thank you for your continued support.


Thought on forcing player to change planes. This can be done smoother if, instead of a single 2 plane wall, you step them into the plane using 1 plane walls. So, let's say they're in the furthest plane and you want them to be in the closest - make the first wall they hit the furthest plane, then inset a little do a 2nd wall that's in the 2nd plane. This prevents them from simple "hitting a wall" and makes a smooth transition to the front plane. Personally, (don't smack me please...) I liked the fact that you were forcing the person into the correct plane before jumping on the grab-spin creature thingies, but before it was confusing because sackboy would just hit a wall.

Good idea. Creature grabbing section has been tweaked so the plane shift is now 100% seamless.


(a little related to above) Right before you hit the section (let's see if I can explain this) where you jump on a platform, jump on an elevator, drop, and drop onto the swinging circle - there is a checkpoint there which is in the furthest back plane. However, you have a wall stopping you from going to the left. This could be a lot smoother if you move the checkpoint to the front plane (so when a person dies, they just jump right again) and move the invisible wall to the right of the checkpoint to force them into this plane before they get to the checkpoint.


Good point and a change has been made.

Thanks again for all of your useful suggestions, I appreciate it.
__________________________________________________ ____


I've been playing your level and I've run into a problem. I've killed the 3 snakes but a large electrical wall is in front of me. Am I supposed to shoot the white thing behind it?


This was a bug that I have fixed in the update. You should have no problems on your next run-through :)


UPDATE

- Added speech bubble at the start telling the player to put on a costume hat glows in the dark (thanks Ccubbage and wex)

- Removed the walls of dissolve during glow worm section due to a bug that allowed the player to clip a worms brain if they got too close thereform destroying the paint switch that dissolves the wall. I have instead added some electrified spikes that will make it tricky to get by unless all the worms are destroyed first. This also gives the player the option of bypassing the worms with the risk of dying and therefore losing points/time. (thanks to all those who pointed out they had a problem here)

- Tweaked plane transition near creature grabbing section (thanks Ccubbage)

- Moved checkpoint and tweaked plane detection near background/foreground section (thanks Ccubbage)

- Completely changed laser section. The laser is no longer leathal and there is only a single large turret firing plasma. Also added a shadow spotlight so the player can see their shots (thanks to everyone for pointing out the difficulty in this section)

Thanks again to all who have played/hearted/commented, I appreciate it.

Morgana25
03-05-2009, 03:29 AM
Just played it - WOW.

I played through twice but finished both times. I think I lucked out on the final boss and found a few sweet spots the first time through. Excellent boss though. The only thing I noticed on the boss is that the camera cuts to the right when you're by the wall and you can pull off a cheap victory by hitting the final brain without most of the danger. Only the purple and white plasma makes it over to the right side. I'm not sure if having the camera stay wide would actually make you more vulnerable to the multitude of ways to die or if it would just make it seem to be that you are more vulnerable. It just seemed a little safe with only the edge of the area where the purple and white balls could get you.

I really like your use of the triangles. Especially the elevator section. Made for a cool visual. The lighting itself on the level is very nicely done. The pulse symbol throughout was also very cool. Visually ties the different areas together nicely. I especially liked the scoreboard design.

My only trouble (besides the minor camera thing at the final boss) was that I kept getting flung into purple plasma on the area with the steps. When I would release the sponge I'd fly right into the plasma. Eventually the timing worked out so I could clear it. It was probably just bad timing on my part but I'm not entirely sure and just wanted to mention it.

Overall another really fun level to play, some great original use of lights and decorations, and some really challenging gameplay.

5 stars and my no strings heart! Nice work.

(didn't hurt that I made it to #3 on the scoreboard when I played either. lol)

iiiijujube
03-05-2009, 04:33 AM
Another great level from OCK, can't wait to play.

cornontheCOD
03-05-2009, 05:15 AM
I liked it, but unfortunately, I didn't finish it.

I died at the part right after the changing layers part. I swung across the rocket balls and saw the electric circles. I thought for sure that they were points, because all the points in the level had been electrified.

Also, when you jump down to the automated swinging ball, I tried jumping left first. The platform on the right looks like an extra bonus points platform, because you can't see the switch yet, and there is a lot more going on on the left. Also, it doesn't really make sense that the switch at that part just randomly gets rid of the gas.

I liked the turret part though, where you can only see your paint bullets in the spotlight. cool stuff.

+ cool visuals, love the red lines everywhere
+ I liked the creature things that rotate when you grab them
+ good use of the paintinator
+ cool pulse theme

-It is unclear where to go at certain parts

F4F: The Dreadnaught

wexfordian
03-05-2009, 08:35 AM
Well I played this again last night and loved it (thanks for editing the laser part ;)). I think the fact you have the race part adds to replayability as higher scores are always at the back of your mind. It also adds to the fun factor as you know you want to get through it quickly to score big but you have to get the right balance between getting through it quickly and getting it right the first time around.

The visuals in the second half of the level remain of a very high quality and the boss fight looks fantastic. It did take me a while to figure out what I was actually meant to be shooting at but the fact you had an infinite checkpoint at the fight allowed me to enjoy it a little more and I didn't have to just franticly mash R1 hoping I'd hit something.

I found the more I played this level the more I enjoyed it. The first time round, players may get confused with the level setup but this is only as there aren't many levels like this around and your throwing them into a new enviroment (which is a good thing!).

I'd suggest anyonereading to give this level a shot. It's fun different and above all, a great way to pass 15/20 mins of your time (yes I scored very badly at the race parts :))

Snowspot
03-05-2009, 09:10 AM
Fun level :D

I liked the pulse theme although after a while my eyes seriously hurt, lol. Lots of variety in this level, always something new to do. Some of the platformer parts were really fun. I liked how you attached rockets to certain swinging segments, made it more interesting. I also thought the part where you have to carefully move between platforms was well done.

Suggestions:

Certain parts are kind of dull, where you seem to be running with nothing in the foreground or background.

The final boss, although interesting, felt amateurish because after I beat him, his attacks kept going. Also, it was just way too much going on at once, it's one thing to use the plasma balls(or whatever they were) as an obstacle.. but it seems like this boss is made artificially hard because of all the visual things on screen. It kind of makes it hard to see what you're doing. I think you should make the goal of the player clear and obvious, just difficult to do. I don't think it's clear enough, except, shoot in that general direction and wait for the "hit" sound. I know there is a speech bubble but that didn't make the weakpoints any easier to spot in the chaos! =-o

Besides that, it was pretty fun.

5 Stars! Hearted!

OCK
03-05-2009, 01:03 PM
Morgana, thanks for all the feedback.


The only thing I noticed on the boss is that the camera cuts to the right when you're by the wall and you can pull off a cheap victory by hitting the final brain without most of the danger.

I agree and will be doing some tweaking here soon.


I really like your use of the triangles. Especially the elevator section. Made for a cool visual.

Thanks for pointing this out. I wanted to take a basic decoration and use it in ways that have not been done before.


My only trouble (besides the minor camera thing at the final boss) was that I kept getting flung into purple plasma on the area with the steps.

I guess you mean the purple laser? There is a switch on the right side used to turn it off.



5 stars and my no strings heart! Nice work.

(didn't hurt that I made it to #3 on the scoreboard when I played either. lol)

Thanks a lot for this I appreciate it. lol at the the "no strings". Congrats on making the number 3 spot :)

__________________________________________________ _________________

corontheCOD, thanks for the feedback.



I died at the part right after the changing layers part. I swung across the rocket balls and saw the electric circles. I thought for sure that they were points, because all the points in the level had been electrified.

That is why I have double life checkpoints liberally spread out everywhere but I understand why you might have thought those were point bubbles...


Also, when you jump down to the automated swinging ball, I tried jumping left first. The platform on the right looks like an extra bonus points platform, because you can't see the switch yet, and there is a lot more going on on the left. Also, it doesn't really make sense that the switch at that part just randomly gets rid of the gas.

Yeah it's called "exploring your surroundings", most levels do it quite frequently lol. How does a switch not make sense? Keep in mind I did not want to hold the players hand too much, that would take away any of the challenge.

Thanks again for playing and leaving feedback. Let me know which of your levels you would like feedback on :)

__________________________________________________ __

wexfordian, thanks for going back and playing the level again, I appreciate it.


Well I played this again last night and loved it (thanks for editing the laser part )

I listen to and appreciate useful feedback and always make changes based upon it :)


The first time round, players may get confused with the level setup but this is only as there aren't many levels like this around and your throwing them into a new enviroment (which is a good thing!).

Thanks for this. My levels always have been and always will be about creating something original/innovative and I appreciate that the casul gamer will not always "get it". I am just happy that accomplished creators such as yourself enjoy what I do :)

Thanks again for checking it out and leaving some great feedback.

__________________________________________________ ___________

Snowspot, thanks for the feedback.



I liked the pulse theme although after a while my eyes seriously hurt, lol.

lol at this comment coming from you, some of your LBA levels have the same effect on the eyes (I recall whaaaale leaving a comment about feeling like he was going blind... ;)



Certain parts are kind of dull, where you seem to be running with nothing in the foreground or background.

Not sure what you are talking about since I have at least one visual element in every part of the level (not necessarily background/foreground but lighting). There is one part that lasts 1.5 seconds (before riding the pulse) where there were no visual elements but I have since added some wonderful new lighting for your viewing pleasure.


The final boss, although interesting, felt amateurish because after I beat him, his attacks kept going. Also, it was just way too much going on at once, it's one thing to use the plasma balls(or whatever they were) as an obstacle.. but it seems like this boss is made artificially hard because of all the visual things on screen. It kind of makes it hard to see what you're doing. I think you should make the goal of the player clear and obvious, just difficult to do. I don't think it's clear enough, except, shoot in that general direction and wait for the "hit" sound. I know there is a speech bubble but that didn't make the weakpoints any easier to spot in the chaos!

lol at "amateurish", you are clearly not a diplomat. The storm staying after the boss is defeated was a conscious decision and I have no plans on changing it. The goal of the player is very clear and obvious: kill the boss... I appreciate not everyone has a "high" level of pereception but I did add a visual cue as to where the bosses weak points are. The lvl is in part meant to be a visual feast and if that adds to the difficulty on the boss then it is not because I wanted to create an "artificial" challenge but rather that I have an artistic vision (which I said I would not like any comments on).



Besides that, it was pretty fun.

5 Stars! Hearted!

Glad you enjoyed it, thanks for the stars/heart.


UPDATE

- added another lightning strike on the right side of the boss

- added a bunch of new lighting on platform leading up to "ride the pulse" (complete with sound effects!)

- Removed the spotlights on "ride the pulse section" (I think having those lighted triangles alone have a stronger visual punch).

Thanks again to all who have played/commented/hearted, I appreciate it :)

mrsupercomputer
03-05-2009, 01:27 PM
Just finished a quick playthrough! My first time through, I suffered from some kind of glitch where I died at the boss, even though I had a full checkpoint. Weird. Anyway, I gave it another go and defeated him!

Highlights:
- Cool visual Style
- Gameplay elements such as the rotating creatures (probably my favorite part) and the spotlight for guiding paintballs. Very cool!
- The pulse and race theme go very well together. I imagine this will lead to a lot of replayability.

Criticisms:
- Sometimes both the darkness of the level and the glow of some obstacles make it difficult to see what an object is (I jumped into the electric, thinking they were scorebubbles, like cornoftheCod did), or where to jump, etc.
- Like Snowspot, I felt that there was a lot going on with the boss. It looked cool, but did make it a bit difficult to see what you are doing. I felt like getting to his right side was pretty difficult because of this. Thank goodness for that infinite checkpoint!

I think you succeeded in creating a heart pumping, visually satisfying race to the finish! Well done.

Snowspot
03-05-2009, 01:35 PM
lol at "amateurish", you are clearly not a diplomat. The storm staying after the boss is defeated was a conscious decision and I have no plans on changing it. The goal of the player is very clear and obvious: kill the boss... I appreciate not everyone has a "high" level of pereception but I did add a visual cue as to where the bosses weak points are. The lvl is in part meant to be a visual feast and if that adds to the difficulty on the boss then it is not because I wanted to create an "artificial" challenge but rather that I have an artistic vision (which I said I would not like any comments on).

hehe. Sorry, not calling you amateurish, just the fact the "storm" doesn't disappear, it doesn't seem intentional, it seems like the "storm" should stop after that.

I think you should accept comments on everything, even if it is about your artistic vision. ... but I guess us people with "low" levels of perception have a hard time understanding such things :P

CCubbage
03-05-2009, 01:46 PM
I think EVERYONE should have to read the fair feedback thread.

It's not always what you're saying it's how you say it. I could either tell my wife her dress is nice but probably doesn't fit the occasion, or I could tell her the outfit will make her stick out like a dead cow at an indian ceremonial dinner....

for instance, it's easier for an author to except simply what you noticed without negative adjectives - for instance "I expected the storm to stop when I killed the boss. I was surprised it didn't"

Boogaloo
03-05-2009, 01:49 PM
I could either tell my wife her dress is nice but probably doesn't fit the occasion, or I could tell her the outfit will make her stick out like a dead cow at an indian ceremonial dinner....

Lol! I concur.

Hey Ock - I'm turning on my system now - feedback shortly.

CCubbage
03-05-2009, 01:54 PM
Just pointing out a fact - many times whether people accept critisism or not depends on how it's presented to them. It helps the receiver to realize you are being constructive.

Snowspot
03-05-2009, 01:56 PM
I think JONMARTIN should have to read the fair feedback thread.

Fixed.

It's fine if I'm being to harsh and I'll stop but... I hate having to sugarcoat things. I think if I had just said "I thought the storm would stop", OCK would reply with "well it's not supposed to stop" but if I call it "amateurish" it's a sign that, I think it's a big problem :P

I did like the level alot, really... OCK always gives me great reviews .. so I feel really bad now.

Sorry

CCubbage
03-05-2009, 02:08 PM
Don't think of it as sugarcoating - think of it as giving objective, easy-to-swallow feedback that won't give the author that little moment of feeling like they were just smacked in the face. :)

GruntosUK
03-05-2009, 05:26 PM
Here are my thoughts OCK, I loved 218, and hearted it, so was looking forward to this.

+ Looks fantastic, the start section with the plasma balls was sxcellent
+ The lighting is superb, I'm playing this in darkenend room and it looks awesome.
+ The Obsctacles and enemies fit in well with the theme and look of the level.
+ Its just the right level of difficulty for me.
+ Good use of the interactive music, hightening tension in the right places.
+ Liked the section with the red beams and the rotating monsters. I enjoyed making my way through that.
+ Just when you think you've seen the best of lighting and FX, more spring at you.

- I never defeated the boss, I got the down to the last brain but had loads of difficulty getting to the other side and hitting the last one, I kept on getting killed by the many different attacks that can and will hit you.

I'm definetly going to give it another play. I could'nt see any real issues in the level anywhere, other than my rubbish LBP skills at the boss.

This is one of the best looking and stylised levels I've seen, it also plays really really well and fun from beginning to end.

***** and hearted.

My F4F level is in the sig. I think you have played the first two levels OCK, the third is unlocked anyway :-)

Jaeyden
03-06-2009, 12:05 AM
Well, I thought 218 was your finest piece of work until now, OCK. You've outdone yourself with the special effects in this level and you should be commended for that. I played it about 4 times when you launched it, then played it again 2 player twice on day two, then I finally beat it last night. I had jotted down some suggestions but after reading through the thread and playing your latest build it looks like anything else I can add would just be redundant. I welcomed the addition of score bubbles to the first obstacle and the new spike traps were a nice touch. You made excellent changes to the boss. I was very confused what to do the first time I played him, but the new text is exactly what you needed to add. It still doesn't make getting to the right side any easier, but then what's a good boss fight without challenge? ;) Congratulations on a great new addition to your lineup. I will be gunning for the players on your leaderboard in the next few days!

Hexagohn
03-06-2009, 11:05 AM
Hey man, played this last night. I Loved it! The look was great, the sound was great, the difficulty was great, I loved your platforming paintinator combo. The level was really, really hard. Took me a few tries to figure out how to beat each bad guy and stuff like that but thats what you wanted. I really loved the part where you walk up the ramp with stuff shooting at you and there are all those orange streaks in the air. The visuals and gameplay at that part really came together and I loved it. The boss was pretty cool but it was really hard, I would say too hard but you have an infinite checkpoint there so it cant be too hard lol, I liked that the races werent really long times, it would take some replaying to get decent times on all the races. I love the point placement and the way you used light to make unique obstacles and gameplay. I loved the part where you have to shoot through the light to see your paint bullets. This is one of my favorite level concepts. Gah, I pretty much loved everything these are just things I really loved.

Alright I got a few suggestions. On some of the enemies it is hard to tell where you are supposed to shoot even though you say to stand in the center I still didn't know what I was shooting at for a bit. Maybe change the color or something to make it more distinct. Also the first bad guy that shoots back, with the electric rollers. You can kill him from the checkpoint and he doesnt shoot far enough to get you. Dont know if you care, but I killed him and it was impossible for him to kill me. That is pretty much it as far as suggestions. I hesitate to say it but maybe ease up the boss a little. That boss has so many things that can kill you it pretty much makes an ace impossible. Not really impossible but I dont think it will ever happen with the boss that hard. Sorry I dont have many suggestions but thats because I like it as is. I really hope people appreciate your difficulty, however I found with my Dodgitron difficulty was disliked. Great job, this level really shows how skilled you are.

Anyway, 5 stars and hearted and I logged onto my second account and hearted it there too!

Boogaloo
03-06-2009, 11:29 AM
Hey Ock,

played this last night and had a real blast. I admire the the way that you really push yourself to deliver high concept visuals. I thought that it was an inventive and visually arresting way of using the VR materials to deliver a look that in no way resembles any other MGS/VR level. And there are some really simple but breathtaking effects between sections when you're just walking past some diagonal multicoloured beams or strips of light. Very effective, and unlike anything that I've seen so far.

With everybody essentially using the same kit, you can become inured to similar building styles and effects - it's really refreshing to play about in a genuinely original and well crafted environment.

The only minor niggles I had were the camera angles for the first enemy - the camera doesn't pan until you're pretty much head to head with the enemy, and I noticed the same thing as Hexagohn - stand far enough back and you can safely blast away, and even though you can't see what you're shooting at, the sound of the paint switch is a tell.

After defeating the cool snakes (I liked how you used the layers there), you have to jump over two sets of spikes, but the camera's fixed and just watches you walking into the distance - making the second set of spikes difficult to judge.

Lastly - take the spikes off of the shoes of the clown boss at the end. I like the sound and fury, the flashes and multicoloured plasmas - but the spikes between the shoes are a real pain, and cross the line that separates 'challenging' and 'frustrating' for me. Especially as you're dodging the spiralling plasma balls in that area at the same time.

A refreshingly original and nicely crafted Racing/Blaster with some inventive Platforms and a terrifying boss, lol - I really enjoyed it, thanks!

Takelow
03-06-2009, 05:29 PM
Just a few words OCK, to say you that i have played the level before you republish it and found it very impressive. Your lights are so beautifull!!!
I have not any time to develop more my thoughts more for now but be sure i will do it as soon as possible! There is so much things to say ;)

But be sure i hearted the level (but i must replay it and heart it again since you delete it), gave it 5 stars .... and really enjoyed it :)

OCK
03-06-2009, 11:19 PM
Thanks to everyone for all the wonderful feedback, I really appreciate it.


mrsupercomputer, thanks for all the feedback.


(I jumped into the electric, thinking they were scorebubbles, like cornoftheCod did)


This has been addressed in the update :)


I think you succeeded in creating a heart pumping, visually satisfying race to the finish! Well done.

That was my goal, thanks!
__________________________________________________ ___________

GrantosUK, thanks for all the feedback.


I never defeated the boss, I got the down to the last brain but had loads of difficulty getting to the other side and hitting the last one, I kept on getting killed by the many different attacks that can and will hit you.

lol, the truth is that I am old-school and back in the day bosses required that the player observe the attack pattern and time their movements accordingly. The boss is actually incredibly easy once you observe which planes the attacks happen on and the timing on he attacks. Sorry you could not finish but there is an infinite checkpoint :)


This is one of the best looking and stylised levels I've seen, it also plays really really well and fun from beginning to end.

***** and hearted.

Thanks a lot for this, I really appreciate it. It's always great when a creator who's work you enjoy likes what you put out there.

__________________________________________________


Jaeyden, thanks for all the feedback.


Well, I thought 218 was your finest piece of work until now, OCK. You've outdone yourself with the special effects in this level and you should be commended for that.

Wow man, thanks! As stated in my first post your SS3 was a big inspiration so your words really mean a lot.


I played it about 4 times when you launched it, then played it again 2 player twice on day two, then I finally beat it last night. I had jotted down some suggestions but after reading through the thread and playing your latest build it looks like anything else I can add would just be redundant. I welcomed the addition of score bubbles to the first obstacle and the new spike traps were a nice touch. You made excellent changes to the boss. I was very confused what to do the first time I played him, but the new text is exactly what you needed to add. It still doesn't make getting to the right side any easier, but then what's a good boss fight without challenge? Congratulations on a great new addition to your lineup. I will be gunning for the players on your leaderboard in the next few days!

Thanks for going back to the level and staying with it. I know the first build was a bit challenging and I think the changes I have made make it more accessible lol.

__________________________________________________ _______________


Hexagohn, thanks for all the feedback.


I loved the part where you have to shoot through the light to see your paint bullets. This is one of my favorite level concepts.

lol that you particularly liked tis section. This part of the level was completely changed since I first published (a couple of times actually) and while thinking of how I could make it a bit easier but still somehow original I thought of the spotlight idea. I am glad you liked it!


Also the first bad guy that shoots back, with the electric rollers. You can kill him from the checkpoint and he doesnt shoot far enough to get you. Dont know if you care, but I killed him and it was impossible for him to kill me.

Thanks for pointing that out but I just realized that if the player stands from afar the it takes longer for the paint to hit it's target therefore leading to a lower race score! So I leave it up to the player: use your skill to fight him up close and get a better time (with the risk of getting killed) or take the safe route and get a lower score :)



That boss has so many things that can kill you it pretty much makes an ace impossible

I aced it yesterday! The boss is EASY if you take the time to observe and time your movements :)


Anyway, 5 stars and hearted and I logged onto my second account and hearted it there too!

Thanks for your support, I appreciate it.

__________________________________________________ ________________


Boogaloo, thanks for all the feedback.


With everybody essentially using the same kit, you can become inured to similar building styles and effects - it's really refreshing to play about in a genuinely original and well crafted environment.

Thanks for this. I am a firm believer in originality and I always try to do something different. I am glad when people enjoy it :)


After defeating the cool snakes (I liked how you used the layers there), you have to jump over two sets of spikes, but the camera's fixed and just watches you walking into the distance - making the second set of spikes difficult to judge.

lol, glow worms people, glow worms (how can anyone think those are snakes???)! I agree about the cam zone and will tweak in my next update.


Lastly - take the spikes off of the shoes of the clown boss at the end.

Done.

__________________________________________________ ___________


Just a few words OCK, to say you that i have played the level before you republish it and found it very impressive. Your lights are so beautifull!!!
I have not any time to develop more my thoughts more for now but be sure i will do it as soon as possible! There is so much things to say

Thanks Takelow and I look forward to your thoughts.


UPDATE

- Added a funny speech bubble just before the elevator telling the player not to confuse electrified spikes with point bubbles ;) (thanks coron and mrsupercomputer)

- Removed spikes from boss' shoes (thanks Boogaloo)

- Made lightning stop after defeating boss (thanks for your thoughts here Snowspot, the rain remains)

Thanks again to all who have played/commented/hearted, I appreciate it.

Killian
03-07-2009, 02:19 PM
I completed your level yesterday on my second try. I was very surprised to see a 3-star rating when it really doesn't deserve one. It's a problem all creators who make difficult levels face. LBP players expect to walk through levels almost unchallenged these days. :(

Clearly your levels biggest plus is the lighting. It looks very cool and original. It will also help me when my epileptic friend comes around! >:D The only problem I had with it was that it was hard to see how many lives you had left but sacrifices had to be made for cool looking checkpoints.

The platforming parts of the level were my favorite. I wish you focused more attention on innovative platforming than on the paintinator but the paintinator sections were still pretty fun. I especially liked the part with that rotating snakes. It was easy, but enjoyable and different.

Your boss looked cool but because the level is dark, I couldn't see where I was shooting as the paintballs aren't lit up and I ended up just shooting at it randomly. I reccomend you add some speech bubbles to highlight where you're supposed to aim.

All in all it was a fun and challenging level. 5 ***** and a heart. :)

dkjestrup
03-07-2009, 07:11 PM
Unfortunately the lvl fell to 3 stars, a little frustrating when I know I make 5 star levels (sorry if that sounds arrogant). I personally think the lvl is medium difficulty but so far only 3 other people have been able to finish it (you guys have been playing too many easy levels lol). Oh well, life goes on.

Well, tbh, I think it deserves the 3 star rating, no offence. I prefered the visual style of Out of Africa, which is why I consider it the best of your levels, but I honestly think this is worthy of 3 stars. I almost gave 218 3 stars, because of the big use of VR materials and black layers with spotlights (I hate that look, sorry, my opinion).

This level, although gameplay wise it is great, I felt the visuals were lacking. That is 100% my opinion, and I wont ask you to change it, but can your next level be in something more mainstream? :confused:

OCK
03-07-2009, 10:41 PM
Killian, thanks for all the feedback, I appreciate it.


Your boss looked cool but because the level is dark, I couldn't see where I was shooting as the paintballs aren't lit up and I ended up just shooting at it randomly.

Thanks for your thoughts here although as I mentioned in a previous post, there is a visual cue as the where the boss' weakpoints are, I am surprised people are having trouble seeing that lol.


All in all it was a fun and challenging level. 5 ***** and a heart.

Thanks for this I appreciate it.
______________________________________________


Well, tbh, I think it deserves the 3 star rating, no offence. I prefered the visual style of Out of Africa, which is why I consider it the best of your levels, but I honestly think this is worthy of 3 stars. I almost gave 218 3 stars, because of the big use of VR materials and black layers with spotlights (I hate that look, sorry, my opinion).

This level, although gameplay wise it is great, I felt the visuals were lacking. That is 100% my opinion, and I wont ask you to change it, but can your next level be in something more mainstream?


I understand that you are an overzsealous 14 year old but I would strongly suggest you only post on people's threads if you have actually played the level and wish to leave useful feedback. If you have your own personal opinions about someones artistic style and core design aesthetic then keep those thoughts to yourself or feel free to PM the person in question who may or may not be interersted in what you have to say.

I do not make "mainstream" lvls but there are plenty of those out there for you to play, try a level called "Ramp".


Thanks to everyone who has played/commented/hearted thus far, I appreciate it :)

Gilgamesh
03-07-2009, 10:55 PM
Hey, just played this level today.

I always find it amazing the amount of work you put into the visuals of a level. Like all of the others you've made, this one doesn't disappoint.

I had a bit of trouble at some of the paintinator enemies because I couldn't tell on which layer the plasma balls were coming from, so I had to end up "guessing" whether I was in the right place or not. It would be useful if there was a bit of reflection or spot on the floor to tell on which layer the balls are, I just don't know if it's possible to do.

Had no real problems with the rest of the level, there was a good mix of platforming and I could easily navigate around even if only my eyes (cat eyes) were visible. I really liked the concept and will try to beat the boss again (I died because I only had one life left by then). :)

RickTheRipper
03-07-2009, 11:29 PM
just got done playing it and i had a good time. the light effects and camera angles were very well done and the platforming/fighting was fun as well.

i really liked the length of the level. usually when the level opens with a race, the end of that race ends the level, but here it just ends a section. those types of races are always fun (multiple chances for top score).

i never found it too difficult but the first time we have to swing (drop onto pendulum-like swing), i got a little annoyed because i kept missing (didn't know it was a swing. thought it was a checkpoint). also, like someone mentioned above, telling which plane the plasma was on got a little tricky.

my only suggestion is to make the camera detection box for the boss a little bigger on the right. i was near the electric wall but couldn't see the boss (had to blindfire).

overall, 5 stars/hearted

dkjestrup
03-08-2009, 01:40 AM
OCK, I have played the level, and liked the gameplay. I just wasn't there with the visuals. Calling me an "overzealous 14 year old" is a bit much imo. I like your levels, I really do, but I just don't like the look. My Opinion.

Snowspot
03-08-2009, 03:06 AM
OCK, I have played the level, and liked the gameplay. I just wasn't there with the visuals. Calling me an "overzealous 14 year old" is a bit much imo.

Lol, hey, you said it was only worth 3 stars! lthought... yeah its kind of strange you give him feedback and he insults you... but then again... you kind of did the same thing lol.. so who knows?!

All I know is I've played pulse like literally 8 times now O_O

dkjestrup
03-08-2009, 05:01 AM
Yeah it's kind of strange you give him feedback and he insults you...
:confused:

It was partly my fault too. Telling him that it is worth three stars unlike the 5 he said it was:blush:

Thegide
03-08-2009, 04:22 PM
Hey OCK,

I tried Pulse for the first time last night. I really enjoyed your visual effects. Darkly-lit levels are always a bit tricky to navigate, but the dramatic lighting makes it worth the sacrifice. I do like the "pulse" spin you've put on the level's story. Your neon EKG readout is great.

I wish I could write a more thorough review right now, but unfortunately I didn't make it very far in the level. This one is HARD. I died at the first paintinator target (actually I lost up to my last life trying to take out the first target, then prompty died immediately on the second target). It was 3am when I was playing, so I didn't have the energy to restart. I'll try to give it another go later and see if I can beat it. Even with no lag, I died a lot at every section.

OCK
03-09-2009, 05:13 AM
Gilgamesh, thanks for leaving your thoughts.


I always find it amazing the amount of work you put into the visuals of a level. Like all of the others you've made, this one doesn't disappoint.

Thanks for pointing this out, I always try to make levels that have really strong visuals.





I really liked the concept and will try to beat the boss again (I died because I only had one life left by then).

The boss has an infinite checkpoint, how did that happen? lol

Thanks again for playing/commenting, I really appreciate it.

_______________________________

RickTheRipper, thanks for leaving your thoughts.



my only suggestion is to make the camera detection box for the boss a little bigger on the right.

Thanks for the suggestion, I will do some tweaking with my next update.


overall, 5 stars/hearted

Thanks for that, I really appreciate it.

____________________________________________

Thegide, thanks for leaving your thoughts.


I wish I could write a more thorough review right now, but unfortunately I didn't make it very far in the level. This one is HARD. I died at the first paintinator target (actually I lost up to my last life trying to take out the first target, then prompty died immediately on the second target)

lol, you are the first person to say you had died so early in the level. Maybe you were very tired? Seriously though, I personally think the level is medium difficulty and if there is one section where the player might die a few times it definitely wouldn't be the first paintinator enemy, those first two guys are a cakewalk.

I hope you get the chance to go back and finish the level at some point, thanks for playing.


UPDATE

- Added new lighting/decoration

- Adjusted cam zone near glow worms section (thanks Boogaloo)

- Made some visual tweaks

Thanks again to all who have played/commented/hearted, I really appreciate it.

wexfordian
03-09-2009, 09:41 AM
Congrats on the spotlight OCK :)

Gilgamesh
03-09-2009, 10:12 AM
[...]The boss has an infinite checkpoint, how did that happen? lol[...]

I don't know, all I know is I had gotten to the boss, died, and it was game over. Maybe there was a strange glitch with the checkpoint. I managed to beat it the second time around though, it wasn't so tough. :)

OCK
03-09-2009, 02:31 PM
Congrats on the spotlight OCK

Thank you kindly and likewise :)


I don't know, all I know is I had gotten to the boss, died, and it was game over. Maybe there was a strange glitch with the checkpoint. I managed to beat it the second time around though, it wasn't so tough.

Definitely one of those infinite checkpoint glitches then but thanks for giving it another shot and finishing :)

rz22g
03-09-2009, 02:43 PM
Hmm.. dont agree on the point that if you cannot finish a level you should not be able to rate it. There are plenty of levels that you just cannot finish because the author did something wrong and did not test it well. Those levels deserve 2 star "needs work". That does not include players who just do not have the skills to finish. This is when you need to "option" of leaving feedback. Still though most of the kids are going to opt to leave feedback anyway because they are mad they could finish and are little **its to begin with...

OCK.. going to check out your level now

EDIT... Ok back from playing. I appreciate the work that went into the level.. no doubt. The lighting effects are nice. Personally I dont care for levels that use the lack of seeing what your doing as part of the play. I can see where the younger crowd might immediately get frustrated and stop before even finishing. With the forced rating they are going to either just press the button and give what rating it had up by default or maybe take the time to show their anger and drop it down a star or two.

CCubbage
03-09-2009, 02:58 PM
Hmm.. dont agree on the point that if you cannot finish a level you should not be able to rate it. There are plenty of levels that you just cannot finish because the author did something wrong and did not test it well. Those levels deserve 2 star "needs work". That does not include players who just do not have the skills to finish. This is when you need to "option" of leaving feedback. Still though most of the kids are going to opt to leave feedback anyway because they are mad they could finish and are little **its to begin with...

OCK.. going to check out your level now

(did this bleed over from another thread?)

When dealing with software design, there is always a tradeoff. The best you can do is find what the best answer is in the situation. The thing you need to keep in mind is the maturity level of the people doing the ratings. Your situation you pose here requires cognitive ability. Many of the young players simply don't have this ability - so allowing them to rate a level without finishing it encourages obnoxious behavior - immature players rating based on personal agenda instead of objective opinions (killing other levels so they can get more hits on theirs, little kids being terrible at a game and rating it poorly).

So, although I agree with your thought I think the tradeoff is worth it. If a level is broken - put a comment on their game telling them so. If a level can't be finished - you will see a high play count with no rating. If a level can be finished but it's crap - you will have low star ratings.

Data should reflect real life - and in real life we don't want video game critics, movie critics, hotel critis, or restaurant critics giving their public opinion unless they've done due diligence.



Back on topic - awesome level, 5 star quality for sure (GREAT concept - I wish I'd thought of it).

Thegide
03-09-2009, 03:11 PM
Thegide, thanks for leaving your thoughts.

lol, you are the first person to say you had died so early in the level. Maybe you were very tired? Seriously though, I personally think the level is medium difficulty and if there is one section where the player might die a few times it definitely wouldn't be the first paintinator enemy, those first two guys are a cakewalk.

I hope you get the chance to go back and finish the level at some point, thanks for playing.


I think the problem is that it's not very clear what you're supposed to be aiming for with those enemies. Jumping the electric logs isn't hard, but when doing it for several minutes trying to locate the target with the paintinator (even in my second playthrough I was trying to get lucky with shots, but had no idea where to really aim, and this holds true with many other targets)

I got further this time, but still was unable to finish the level. This time I lost all my lives at the start of the 3rd race gate (moving platforms). One thing I noticed here was that you no longer illuminate the floor section. As such, I probably ran to my death 2-3 times after spawning because I didn't know where the floor ended.

sny
03-09-2009, 07:58 PM
Well, I have mixed emotions after having played through this twice, part of me really liked the level, but another one found it quite annoying... I'll let both parts of me speak their mind (taking turns, to make it more exciting :rolleyes: ), I hope you don't mind. :)

+ The concept itself is brilliant, I always liked creations with a central theme where the author establishes and sticks with a distinctive style. No matter where you look, there is something that catches your eye and you keep wondering how on earth (or in this case, LittleBigPlanet) it was done. :)
- This is also the biggest drawback of the level, IMO. There is simply too much to look at for any given screen, the vivid lights and bright neon colours make you focus on places that normally don't even require your attention. This made me waste a lot of lives even on sections I would consider very easy on other levels. I think the balance between playability and incredible visuals is a bit uneven here.
+ The creatures are unique and very well designed, they felt like viable denizens of a creepy neon-world such as this (as crazy as that may sound :D )
- All of them with the exception of the last had a blind spot you can abuse to safely kill them (you just had to stand in the middle plane and be quite far away from the first one, you could shoot any of the three caterpillars from the other side of the hill and once that one died, progress in the plane it used to be, and the creature with the flamethrower (or some similar thingamajig) never reached you if you just stood at the very end of the platform)
+ The end boss was simply AWESOME! I hated it on my first play-through, saying "oh come on, this one has no rhyme or reason to its actions", only to realize how well it was made when I got there the second time around. Excellent work, by far the best part of the level IMO.
- The side brains could be killed without being in range of its attacks (though I suppose that's okay, since the middle brain and the task of getting to the other side IS a formidable challenge all by itself), and if you die at the wrong time, there is a chance that you'll be hit by plasma balls the instant you respawn (I lost all my three remaining lives in three seconds on the first time there like this), so perhaps moving the checkpoint into a safer spot further back could help. :)

And finally:

+- The trick score bubbles were so bleepin evil... *grumble* ...nah, I loved it! I think 90% of people probably fall for that one, so cleverly placed after a tough section. :p

All in all, I felt that my poor Sackboy was unduly bombarded by vivid shapes and colours and a bit intimidated by the experience, but I also think that the end made it worthwhile, and I'll have no second thoughts recommending it to those of my friends who like a hard challenge.

Takelow
03-10-2009, 08:59 AM
Hi OCK,

I found the time to replay the level, and really enjoyed it. First of all, i disagree with most of the comments about the level to be d too difficult. I played the level two times (one before your republish, one after) and finished it two time at the first try. I am not a good player however.
Actually, I found the difficulty perfectly dosed in this level: there is more than one time that i successed a section with the last live of the checkpoint. I found this great in the scope of the pulse. When you play the level, in a challenging section, lost all your lives but one, heard this alarm, and absolutely MUST succed the section, you clearly feel your own heart pulsing!

-I loved your tittle screen and found it very original and appropriate.
-I loved a lot the start of the level with the yellow pulse to follow, and the killing light.
-There is a lot of gameplay different elements in the level, and some are completely unseen (i think about the grabble round pulses with motors that are activated by the grab).
-The paintinator section are good and as always, your custom ennemies very well constructed.
- Your lights are jaw-drapping here. It is now clear for me that you perfectly master this point (among other of course). There is a lot of different light sources, shapes, colors...and all is mixing very well. I found some of the final section incredibles!
- I loved the global concept of PULSE.
- It is perfect OCK-made level ;)

My suggest are more about the final boss. I know that an artistic vision is personnal and i totally respect this, but my opinion is that your final boss didn't really fit your theme.
During the level, i was permanently asking what will be the final bosses (This is an OCK level, so, THERE IS A FINAL BOSS!). Honestly, i was waiting a giant heart, or a giant elecrtocardiogram machine... i mean something more related to "Pulse". Moreover, in a purely artistic form, all the level is directed by lights, but not the boss. There is some light elements in the last battle, but the boss in itself didn't contain any lighting element.
Don't get me wrong: the boss is very well done, interesting to play and fight, but i quit the atmosphere you perfectly distilled all along the level at this point.

Nevertheless, the level is really great! I rated it 5 stars gave it a BIG HEART, and tagged it "artistic".

PS: I was really sad to see the global rate of the level, and can't bear the idea it is only a 3 stars rated level... It is absolutely ridiculous!!! What is wrong with the players? What is a 4 stars or a 5 stars rated level if Pulse is 3 stars?
I really DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS!

CCubbage
03-10-2009, 12:10 PM
You KNOW it's a good game when there is so many opinions and disagreements. It shows incredible depth. And I think your levels stir up more opinions than I've EVER seen.

(I'm a little jealous.)

And I PERSONALLY had the same experience Takelow had (although the things he mentioned with the boss didn't really occur to me) - The first time I tried I figured out the boss and beat it. But people definately think differently.

mostevilmilo
03-10-2009, 01:57 PM
Tried this level out, and was wowed by how pretty it is. :)


The good stuff:
- Visually, very beautiful. Loved the all those colorful lights, which I think you used very well. Very, very artistic!
- Great central theme! The pulse and the lights thing was cool. And I loved how the level was so consistent from start to finish.
- Cool creature designs. Loved the "fishy" things with the grab-able heads, hehe...
- There were some ingenious traps and obstacles here! Loved the trick score bubbles. :)


Stuff I didn't like so much:
Well, these are all personal opinions only.
- The lights were beautiful, but there were some areas were there were probably just too many bright lights on the screen at the same time. It's kinda painful to the eyes, especially when all those lights are, well, pulsing.
- I love the paintinator. For me, however, nothing beats a good old-fashioned obstacle/puzzle. Sometimes, paintinator battles slow down the pace of a level instead of making it more exciting. This is most especially true when you have one paintinator battle after another. Another problem with too many paintinator battles is that it kinda reduces the game to an old-school shoot-em-up. Which is probably no biggie for some people, but I prefer brain-tickling puzzles and adrenaline-pumping platforming to shoot-everything-that-moves type levels.
This was how I felt in the area where you have to fight three consecutive bad guys with the paintinator. I felt it slowed down the game a bit, and took away strategy and platforming goodness.


One of your prettiest levels so far. And although it is a good level, it's also one that will probably not be everyone's cup of tea. But I guess that's to be expected with such a unique theme like this.

If you have time please try my Omaha level! :) The link is with my sig. I would really appreciate your F4F. Thanks!

OCK
03-11-2009, 12:23 AM
Kratos, thanks for your thoughts, I appreciate it.
__________________________________________

Ccubbage, thanks for your continued support.



So, although I agree with your thought I think the tradeoff is worth it. If a level is broken - put a comment on their game telling them so. If a level can't be finished - you will see a high play count with no rating. If a level can be finished but it's crap - you will have low star ratings.

Thanks for always putting things into context and examining the situation in a logical manner, I appreciate it :)



You KNOW it's a good game when there is so many opinions and disagreements. It shows incredible depth. And I think your levels stir up more opinions than I've EVER seen.

lol, I guess it's a love it or hate type of level.
______________________________________


sny, thanks for your feedback.


- All of them with the exception of the last had a blind spot you can abuse to safely kill them

I believe I adressed this in a previous post. If the player wished to "cheat" and shoot things from afar then it will take longer to kill the creatures and therefore result in a lower race time. The closer the player is, the quicker the paint will hit it's target :)


+ The end boss was simply AWESOME! I hated it on my first play-through, saying "oh come on, this one has no rhyme or reason to its actions", only to realize how well it was made when I got there the second time around. Excellent work, by far the best part of the level IMO.

I am glad you enjoyed it and wish I could have made it more complex but my thermo would not allow it.


and if you die at the wrong time, there is a chance that you'll be hit by plasma balls the instant you respawn

Problem solved in the update.



All in all, I felt that my poor Sackboy was unduly bombarded by vivid shapes and colours and a bit intimidated by the experience, but I also think that the end made it worthwhile, and I'll have no second thoughts recommending it to those of my friends who like a hard challenge.

Thanks for playing and leaving your thoughts, I appreciate. I will check out your level in the next few days and leave feedback on your thread.

______________________________________________

Thegide, thanks for going back and trying the level again. I am sorry it is still too challenging for you.


I probably ran to my death 2-3 times after spawning because I didn't know where the floor ended.

Solved in the update :)

_________________________________________________

Takelow, thanks for leaving so much feedback.


First of all, i disagree with most of the comments about the level to be d too difficult. I played the level two times (one before your republish, one after) and finished it two time at the first try.

I remember you once told me that you are not a very good player so if you did not find it difficult then that means the level should be accessible to everybody lol. Thanks for this.



-I loved your tittle screen and found it very original and appropriate.

I am happy you point this out. To the best of my knowledge I am the first person to actually use plasma to form letters and I think it has a great visual impact.


Your lights are jaw-drapping here. It is now clear for me that you perfectly master this point (among other of course). There is a lot of different light sources, shapes, colors...and all is mixing very well. I found some of the final section incredibles!

Thanks for this. We all know who the other Master is ;)


During the level, i was permanently asking what will be the final bosses (This is an OCK level, so, THERE IS A FINAL BOSS!). Honestly, i was waiting a giant heart, or a giant elecrtocardiogram machine... i mean something more related to "Pulse". Moreover, in a purely artistic form, all the level is directed by lights, but not the boss. There is some light elements in the last battle, but the boss in itself didn't contain any lighting element.
Don't get me wrong: the boss is very well done, interesting to play and fight, but i quit the atmosphere you perfectly distilled all along the level at this point.

For the most part I actually agree with you here. I added Pulse symbols to the boss` body to help it fit the theme but I suppose it could have fit in even more (thermo allowing). I originally wanted to create a pulse on it's body out of green LED's which would light up in sequence but it did not work out. Overall though I am happy with the final result.

Nevertheless, the level is really great! I rated it 5 stars gave it a BIG HEART, and tagged it "artistic".


PS: I was really sad to see the global rate of the level, and can't bear the idea it is only a 3 stars rated level... It is absolutely ridiculous!!! What is wrong with the players? What is a 4 stars or a 5 stars rated level if Pulse is 3 stars?
I really DON'T UNDERSTAND THIS!

Thanks for this, I appreciate it. Yesterday my level was on page 2 of Cool Levels. There is another level called "Desert Ice race" or something like that on page 2 which is basically a level with nothing in it and the player running from left to right collecting hundreds of point bubbles. This level had a 4 star rating and a higher H2P ration then Pulse! I think this is indicative of the general age level of those playing LBP and the many problems related to the rating system...

__________________________________________________

mostevilmilo, thanks for all the feedback.


It's kinda painful to the eyes, especially when all those lights are, well, pulsing.

I agree 100%. That is why in my first post I wrote "not recommended to those who are sensitive to bright lights" lol. Some of my favorite levels are those that take place in darkness (Way of Light, Illumina Garden) and my eye do hurt a bit while playing these levels but it is the nature of the beast :)



- I love the paintinator. For me, however, nothing beats a good old-fashioned obstacle/puzzle.

I think it's fair to say I have a 50/50 mix of platforming and paintinator. Puzzles have no place in this theme and in the "feeling" I was trying to create which is the only reason they are not present.

Thanks for your thoughts and sorry for not leaving feedback on Omaha after you gave me feedback on 218 (I actaully DID play it and hit a bug and forgot to get back to it). Expect feedback in the next couple of days :)


UPDATE

- Added spotlight to illuminate ground near spawn point of background/forground section (thanks Thegide)

- Added glass wall in front of spawn point of boss (thanks to all who mentioned problems here).

- Minor visual tweaks

Thanks to everyone for checking the level out and leaving your thoughts, I appreciate it.

I think I have recieved sufficient feedback and will no longer be doing any F4F's. If you check out the level then leave me a couple of thoughts in-game and I will check out your level and repay the courtesy. :)

Thegide
03-11-2009, 01:32 AM
Ok, no funny stuff. I set out to beat it this time and I did it. Thanks for making those recommended edits OCK, they did help.

I had no problems make it to my previous "furthest" spot. This is the sort of level that once you know what to do, its not so bad. But, its tough to figure out what to do the first time. It's also tricky figuring out what will kill you and what won't on your first time through an area. At the end of the platforming section, the platform that takes you down is behind glass (I think). Unless you're looking carefully, it's easy to think you can drop down in front to land on it... but nope. At the bottom of this, I mistook the swinging balls for a checkpoint and assumed there was ground under me... nope.

The boss was really well done, although it took me a while to figure out where his targets were. I saw the brains, but didn't make the connection until the 2nd brain was down that his shoulder pads were the targets. I still am unsure what the 3rd target was, but I did manage to hit it. This is one of the reasons why I leave paint switches visible - it really helps people figure out what the target is. Another tough part here is that because of the darkness, you're never quite sure which layer you're in. This isn't something you can fix either... it's just fact based on the game mechanics.

Anyways, quirks and difficulty aside, this level is really cool. I haven't seen a level so visually intense before... everything is neon and bright. I understand how hard it is to build a level in the dark too, so the fact you were able to pull it off at all deserves a lot of merit. Looking forward to your next project!

frizby
03-20-2009, 02:07 PM
Pulse looks amazing and some of the lighting is beautiful.

That said, I have to echo thegide in saying that I was thoroughly confused most of the time about what to do next. I'd say generally that the use of depth when the player can't see depth is problematic. I also noted several instances where I was in near complete darkness and didn't even know which direction you wanted me to go in. I had to start the level over twice on the first miniboss, mostly because the angular velocity on the "log" felt too high. I made it through from there, but it was mostly trial and error.

I also struggled with the the timing on the first two sets of "lights that kill you", as it seemed sort of random at first. And it was confusing that some lights kill you and some don't.

The last boss was great, but I ultimately killed him by hanging out on the edges and shooting till I heard the noise from the paintinator switch. I can't imagine getting in there and fighting him as you likely intended...just too much chaos.

I ABSOLUTELY appreciate the aesthetic and the amount of work that went into this one, but I can't say that I had fun with it. I was mostly just frustrated. Sorry.

mostevilmilo
03-22-2009, 04:01 AM
I actaully DID play it and hit a bug and forgot to get back to it

May I please know what bug that is? So maybe I can change it. :)

CCubbage
03-23-2009, 12:20 PM
Just wanted to make 1 quick point on this thread.

You know... I've felt like I was in the twilight zone for a while with this level - I played the original before a lot of the changes were made, and I pretty much flew threw it. At that point, the only issue I had was in some places I couldn't see the paintinator bullets (but that was rectified).

Last night a buddy of mine came over who had NEVER played LBP. I had him play some of my levels and some other easier ones until he got used to the controls. Then, I said, "Ok... I want you to see this one" and I put in Pulse and had him play it. (keep in mind, he's not a 'hardcore' gamer).

Yes, he died a few times. He played it several times, each time getting a little more determined. After a few times, he started really blasting through it and having fun. I asked him if he thought it was too hard or confusing. He said "Not really - it wasn't too hard, but I had to really pay attention. It was the only level that felt like a REAL game I would buy in the store."

This level definately does not fit the general LBP mold - just like games like Ninja Gaiden or the original Contra - it takes concentration, and some experimenting to do well. It's a REAL game, not a walkthrough. And even though it probably blew OCK's gasket, I'm really glad he made it because, in the end, it allows more people to have fun with LittleBigPlanet.

Great job!

Jaeyden
03-24-2009, 10:33 PM
Agreed. It's also worth noting that he took a lot of the feedback in this thread and ACTUALLY applied it to the level after publishing. It's a shame that the sheer number of levels out there creates so many "tourists" that are only along for the sights. Having played this level several times since it was first published, I've seen it evolve and change based on the feedback from everyone here. I didn't beat it until my fourth or fifth play, but that's the point. I still don't understand why people apply different standards to LBP than other games. If you bought a game and it held your hand from beginning to end....you never died, never had to start over, never had to figure anything out....would you enjoy it? I doubt it. You'd probably be trading it in at the game store right now. I really appreciated what OCK did with this level. He tried something new, he made it his own, he didn't hold anyone's hand and he put his heart and soul into this artistic endeavor.

CCubbage
03-25-2009, 12:11 AM
EXACTLY! Man, you said it WAY better than I did. THAT'S the reason I really enjoy LittleBigPlanet Central - this is the place where I can find the levels that make it worth having LittleBigPlanet. I grew up on the classics. It was struggling through Donkey Show's Phantasy level that brought me here (I was fighting the dragon, had to exit and leave the game, came back a little later and THE LEVEL HAD DISAPPEARED!!! so I searched on the internet and found LBPC).

The truth is, I TOTALLY understand why this level is 3 stars from the general LBP audience - but aren't we tougher than that here? In this web site, this should be a 5 star level period.

I can see it now:

"Umm.... Mr. Game Developer... I got killed by the Big Daddy when I went up to hit him with my wrench - I consider this a problem with your game. Is there any way you could take away all of his weapons by the release of BioShock? It was kind of frustrating having to figure out how to kill him."

"Yeah sure, Mr. Gamer. I'm sure the game will be a lot more fun and will sell more if we take all danger away and let you just enjoy the scenery of Rapture. Can we include a pillow in the game box to make you more comfortable?"

frizby
03-25-2009, 12:24 AM
"Yeah sure, Mr. Gamer. I'm sure the game will be a lot more fun and will sell more if we take all danger away and let you just enjoy the scenery of Rapture. Can we include a pillow in the game box to make you more comfortable?"

That would have made Bioshock so much better. ;)

I appreciate a challenge, and I absolutely appreciate the work Ock put into this level. I'm also happy to give it another runthrough. Really, my ONLY complaint was that it lacked some visual cues in regards to what hurts you and what doesn't, what you can grab and what you can't, where to shoot, and where to go. I don't think it needs to be "dumbed down", and I don't mean to insult the artistic endeavour. I was simply under the impression that folks came here for honest feedback in order to improve their levels...sort of like a community of playtesters.

My levels have changed significantly for the better directly as a result of being told what didn't work, and ultimately, I appreciate that input much more than "great job, now play my level".

So, I hope I didn't offend...just trying to help. :)

CCubbage
03-25-2009, 12:49 AM
I totally agree, and I wasn't directly targeting you. I was mostly looking at the entire thread that I've been following for weeks.

Once of the hardest things to do when reviewing is figure out what kind of game an author is trying to create, and give feedback within that context.

For instance, if a level is supposed to be a kids game but has many difficult parts in it, I mention that.

This specific level is a race which requires quite a bit of practice to perfect. Each piece of it has depth and a strategy to maximize points and time. It's closer to a classic arcade game than a general LBP level.