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View Full Version : Thoughts on LBP's Current State?



gurren009
11-20-2016, 10:02 AM
I know this technically isn't site feedback, but what do you guys think is the current state of lbp? Now that the japanese servers are gone, and LBPK's online has been completely shut down, how is lbp right now? Is it still alive? Is it dead(as much as it pains me to say that)?

Lord-Dreamerz
11-20-2016, 10:16 AM
I'd call it a zombie, AKA the living dead. It still has a player/fan base around but it's a super joke compared to what it was couple years ago.

gurren009
11-20-2016, 10:48 AM
I agree. I think it might be because of the initial glitches that came with LBP3 at launch. Not to mention the lack of stable online also hurt it :(

Lord-Dreamerz
11-20-2016, 11:28 AM
I agree. I think it might be because of the initial glitches that came with LBP3 at launch. Not to mention the lack of stable online also hurt it :(

Those things did hurt it yeah. but they were not the only problems.

gurren009
11-20-2016, 11:58 AM
Do you think it's Sumo's fault, or the community's fault for not staying with it? Idk, personally. I'm just glad that Sumo at least revived LBP from the brink of extinction. I guess MM knew lbp was dead ever since lbp2(copiers, community drama, etc).

Devious_Oatmeal
11-20-2016, 01:08 PM
Do you think it's Sumo's fault, or the community's fault for not staying with it? Idk, personally. I'm just glad that Sumo at least revived LBP from the brink of extinction. I guess MM knew lbp was dead ever since lbp2(copiers, community drama, etc).

Well. You can't really blame people in general if they choose to not stick around something that they no longer feel gives them what they want. Everyone has left for their reasons, be it the glitches to things like their actual life changing.

It's a mix of a lot of things, but people choosing to not stick around is not something you can blame. Especially since no one came into this community or game thinking "I hope this fails."

But LBP3 was supposed to be the 'great revival'. Like, a new season of a show that stirs the community and fans once again in order to bring them back. Buuuuuuuut, yeah. It had its hiccups and then a lot of negativity spread due to the problems, and so now we are here.

Dreams is the 'new LBP' to a lot of people as well.

mdkd99
11-20-2016, 01:25 PM
Everyone has different opinions. I say, LBP is not dead. It got smaller, but it's still in shape.

Sony wanted LBP3 fast. Too fast. The players don't have patience because of bugs and think it's the best to leave. It's their way.

I had many good memories with LBP1/2/Vita. I must be a fool if I throw it away. The bye bye part of the japanese community was hard though.

gurren009
11-20-2016, 01:34 PM
Well. You can't really blame people in general if they choose to not stick around something that they no longer feel gives them what they want. Everyone has left for their reasons, be it the glitches to things like their actual life changing.

It's a mix of a lot of things, but people choosing to not stick around is not something you can blame. Especially since no one came into this community or game thinking "I hope this fails."

But LBP3 was supposed to be the 'great revival'. Like, a new season of a show that stirs the community and fans once again in order to bring them back. Buuuuuuuut, yeah. It had its hiccups and then a lot of negativity spread due to the problems, and so now we are here.

Dreams is the 'new LBP' to a lot of people as well.

I agree. I just don't want to put 100% of the blame on Sumo, since I'm so glad that they at least saved the franchise from eternal desolation, lol. I think really, it's Sony's fault. They were too obsessed with money that not only did they rush LBP3 to be holdiay 2014 when it could have easily be released later on in 2015, but they also had LBP3 be on both the PS3 and PS4 instead of just the PS4, which caused a massive amount of glitches to both consoles. Many people left because of glitches like losing their profiles(all their dlc and everything) and not being able to connect to anyone online. A lot of these issues have been fixed, but it's left us with a much smaller community. "What do we do now? Where do we go from here?" are 2 big questions we're all probably asking ourselves. But I think Sumo is doing the right thing, ever since they released the new "community challenges" update. Bringing community together, no matter how small it is, is a right step for the LBP community.

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Everyone has different opinions. I say, LBP is not dead. It got smaller, but it's still in shape.

Sony wanted LBP3 fast. Too fast. The players don't have patience because of bugs and think it's the best to leave. It's their way.

I had many good memories with LBP1/2/Vita. I must be a fool if I throw it away. The bye bye part of the japanese community was hard though.

Yeah, having the japanese community taken from us was a huge slap in the face. With such a small community left, I agree, we have to stick together, and rebuild ourselves. Keep supporting Sumo, no matter how small the community is. The community is probably not going to get any larger, but maybe we need to find ways to attract new folks to the lbp franchise. But the one question at the back of my mind is always "Is it too late? Is there no hope for lbp to return". It always bothers me, which is why I think it's best for the community to stay strong together.

Lord-Dreamerz
11-20-2016, 05:42 PM
You are ignoring some of the other reasons. People also left LBP because many just got tired of it. You'd see many common gamers say "Sony made yet ANOTHER one!? When will they stop milking this series?" So as sad as it may sound regardless if a title is bad or good sometimes people may just get sick of it anyways. And among other reasons many of the most skilled creators from the community wanted to move on after awhile to make real games and profit from their hard work, you can't just continue to do free work forever unless it's very small projects that don't take months/years of your life, or if you already have a good paying job that allows enough free time to spare... one has to remember majority of the best creators in the community are adults.

And absolutely no, despite what some fans want to think... the people who copy levels or release junk were never a problem meaningful enough to make folkz truly quit especially considering all that stuff has been happening since LBP1 and happens with real games and everywhere in life... Check the Steam green-light stories out sometime if you haven't already.

mdkd99
11-21-2016, 09:22 AM
Really? When I saw, LBP3 is going to be published, I was happy. New features, improved quality and sth. That was cool. The bugs were annoying, but it was OK, because the bugs are getting less from time to time. They care about the game.

I think it got smaller. And to be honest: You can say, that the franchise is dead and cry about old times, or you could try to give it a second attempt. But that's too difficult for many. If less people try it, I won't try it. Nonsense. I still enjoy LBP on the home console and on PS Vita.

blacksackman
11-21-2016, 11:05 AM
All LBP games had their limited time when the player-base was it at it's peak. LBP3 is two years old in a couple of days and and after that the player base will drop drastically. When the two year period has passed you'll begin to recognize a pattern such as lower plays on community levels and less new levels. As a creator myself I always aim to publish something between the release date and the three year mark because after that any work you publish will gain little attention due to the low activity within the game. But the buggy release really screwed up the natural life cycle of the game and as a result the player base started to diminish even before the two year mark.

All games has a limited lifetime - which basically lasts as long as the casual players sticks around. Eventually even the most hardcore players/creators moves on to other games. When the activity is going downhill at a high rate the developers will stop making new DLC to milk the user-base as it will be too small for any maintainable profit. So in short, when the developers stops to make new downloadable content and updates you could label LBP3 as 'dead' from a general perspective.

jwwphotos
11-21-2016, 11:20 AM
Created a new Forum and moved this into it... as the OP is right, it isn't site feedback. ;) ..but it didn't really fit any other forum very well, so it made sense to make this.. LBP General Discussion forum. :)

Devious_Oatmeal
11-21-2016, 02:17 PM
I agree. I just don't want to put 100% of the blame on Sumo, since I'm so glad that they at least saved the franchise from eternal desolation, lol. I think really, it's Sony's fault. They were too obsessed with money that not only did they rush LBP3 to be holdiay 2014 when it could have easily be released later on in 2015, but they also had LBP3 be on both the PS3 and PS4 instead of just the PS4, which caused a massive amount of glitches to both consoles. Many people left because of glitches like losing their profiles(all their dlc and everything) and not being able to connect to anyone online. A lot of these issues have been fixed, but it's left us with a much smaller community. "What do we do now? Where do we go from here?" are 2 big questions we're all probably asking ourselves. But I think Sumo is doing the right thing, ever since they released the new "community challenges" update. Bringing community together, no matter how small it is, is a right step for the LBP community.

Assuming that Sumo did not push to have the game separated by next-gening it, then yeah. A lot of the blame can't be put on them. There's only so much they can do when they have corporate shoving things down their throats.


But the game's not dead. The fact that people are still publishing levels, talking on forums for LBP, and being an active community, are all signs of a living... well, thing. "Is it dying?" is a different question however...




As for LBP 3's lifetime... that can be arguable. It had the potential to last quite a while if certain decisions had and had not been made. True, this can be said about all games, but I am coming from the view of "if it had an actually decent release". With the vastness of how versatile the sandboxing was, and with a steady support from Sony, this game could have lasted quite a while. I say this, because unlike most other games, you play them a few times and say, "Well I have done everything." In LBP3, there was no 'everything'. Even now, there are new things being made and worked on that surprise people. New things are still popping up. LBP3 is a lake that people have yet to fully explore; Dreams being an ocean of course. ;P

If you can't tell by now, I have stocks in LBP3. STOCKS OF WITHERING HOPES THAT IS! 8U

mdkd99
11-21-2016, 06:44 PM
That's what I think. Many games are finished after a while. But LBP is different because you can do a lot.

gurren009
11-21-2016, 09:00 PM
That's what I think. Many games are finished after a while. But LBP is different because you can do a lot.
Exactly! And that's why I'm against charging people for certain creations on Dreams, because it loses that "endless sandbox" feeling that we all came to know and love from LBP.


Assuming that Sumo did not push to have the game separated by next-gening it, then yeah. A lot of the blame can't be put on them. There's only so much they can do when they have corporate shoving things down their throats.


But the game's not dead. The fact that people are still publishing levels, talking on forums for LBP, and being an active community, are all signs of a living... well, thing. "Is it dying?" is a different question however...




As for LBP 3's lifetime... that can be arguable. It had the potential to last quite a while if certain decisions had and had not been made. True, this can be said about all games, but I am coming from the view of "if it had an actually decent release". With the vastness of how versatile the sandboxing was, and with a steady support from Sony, this game could have lasted quite a while. I say this, because unlike most other games, you play them a few times and say, "Well I have done everything." In LBP3, there was no 'everything'. Even now, there are new things being made and worked on that surprise people. New things are still popping up. LBP3 is a lake that people have yet to fully explore; Dreams being an ocean of course. ;P

If you can't tell by now, I have stocks in LBP3. STOCKS OF WITHERING HOPES THAT IS! 8U
I agree, the game is definitely not dead, especially when new people are still buying it and people are making so many fantastic creations(which I'm glad that Sumo revived LBP for). But yeah as for it's lifespan, probably not too long, but hey, a small community can stick together :)

koltonaugust
11-24-2016, 08:31 AM
Very few games survive a shift in companies. I'd say the series lasted longer than I had thought it would. MM decided that a change in name would be best for their "creation" game. Many LBP fans have been wanting to go 3D for a while and Dreams seems to be that promise delivered. I think the dropping Sackboy is just to A) make the older fans feel less weird about still playing a kids game and B) avoid complaints about milking a series. I do think LBP will die shortly after dreams is fully released, but I'm also not really sad to see it go (except for the unique 2.5D platforming) as it's not really going to be gone, is it?

jwwphotos
11-24-2016, 01:29 PM
Very few games survive a shift in companies. I'd say the series lasted longer than I had thought it would. MM decided that a change in name would be best for their "creation" game. Many LBP fans have been wanting to go 3D for a while and Dreams seems to be that promise delivered. I think the dropping Sackboy is just to A) make the older fans feel less weird about still playing a kids game and B) avoid complaints about milking a series. I do think LBP will die shortly after dreams is fully released, but I'm also not really sad to see it go (except for the unique 2.5D platforming) as it's not really going to be gone, is it?

Interesting thoughts. :)

Platforming... that is what I have been wondering as well. Possibly I haven't seen enough clips, but Dreams doesn't strike me as a platformer as much as LBP. If you know of clips showing platforming, please post them in the Dreams forum as I haven't been able to keep up on everything this past year.

...but I'm getting better! lol

Lord-Dreamerz
11-24-2016, 02:04 PM
Interesting thoughts. :)

Platforming... that is what I have been wondering as well. Possibly I haven't seen enough clips, but Dreams doesn't strike me as a platformer as much as LBP. If you know of clips showing platforming, please post them in the Dreams forum as I haven't been able to keep up on everything this past year.

...but I'm getting better! lol

From what they showed it is not a straight forward platformer. The story-mode I'm guessing from the bits they shown us are is a variety game full of different types of small 3D style games with platformer likely only being part of it.

jwwphotos
11-24-2016, 03:48 PM
From what they showed it is not a straight forward platformer. The story-mode I'm guessing from the bits they shown us are is a variety game full of different types of small 3D style games with platformer likely only being part of it.

Yeah.. that is what it was looking like to me. Thanks..

mdkd99
11-25-2016, 07:40 AM
Hold on, has anyone ever thought about Tearaway? That has shown 3D movement. I think Dreams is everything. 2D, 3D, TopDown, 2.5D. I think it will be anything.

jwwphotos
11-25-2016, 11:33 AM
Well... true.. I just haven't seem many platforming examples in Dreams. Even in Tearaway, the platforming wasn't as intense as LBP.

..but I am sure something like that can be achieved, just would like to see some examples and possibilities over fluffy scenery and goofy fun characters.

mdkd99
11-25-2016, 01:20 PM
Me too.

Do you think it's possible to make a 2.5D platformer with a movement like LBP has?

jwwphotos
11-25-2016, 02:11 PM
That is what I am wondering too..

koltonaugust
11-26-2016, 09:59 AM
Based off of that one video where they are creating a hill or something to get to a door (I don't really remember but it was something to do with creating as a form of playing in their conversation), I have high hopes. The logic is what I'm worried about since it would be hard at launch to even match LBP2's complexity. In addition to that, adapting certain UI mechanics (notes) from vita and LBP3 is not easy. I'm assuming with how much focus character creation is getting it would be easy to modify jumps and stuff, but the only game that is similar (Spore (specifically galactic adventures)) did not handle that part well.
As for the 2.5D, I doubt it would be easy, but I also think it would be possible. The main thing that would be difficult is the auto switches of layers.

jwwphotos
11-26-2016, 12:57 PM
I was just thinking if you had a 3D game, but built a wall as your artificial back wall. ...then it would be a matter of tweaking cameras. Heck.. there may even be a 2.5 camera mode. lol

koltonaugust
11-27-2016, 07:59 AM
Oh, lol. I thought you meant imitate the exact style of 2.5D platforming LBP has! LBP has weird layer mechanics, so that's why I was thinking it would be difficult

mdkd99
11-27-2016, 03:25 PM
It is weard compared to other games.

Ryuhza
11-28-2016, 11:29 AM
Feels like a series in purgatory.

Sadly, my own interest waned midway last year. I still had projects and ideas, but frustrations with the toolset and glitches paired with a clearly waning community drove away my will to lose myself in those endeavors. Doesn't help that I'm not a teenager anymore (and haven't been for four years) and I'm taking on many more responsibilities and stresses.

I'd like to think that Dreams will revive both my interest and the interest of the general public, but response from many folks thus far seems to be tepid confusion, and that doesn't give me much hope for the long run.

mdkd99
11-28-2016, 07:32 PM
I think I will stop answering, because I am repeating myself over and over again.

LBP isn't dead. The community got smaller, but there are still good levels out there. Many creative guys are still out there. And if you really love LBP and its community, than do something for it. Be creative too, play levels, sacrifice some time into LBP, if you can.

gurren009
11-28-2016, 07:59 PM
I think I will stop answering, because I am repeating myself over and over again.

LBP isn't dead. The community got smaller, but there are still good levels out there. Many creative guys are still out there. And if you really love LBP and its community, than do something for it. Be creative too, play levels, sacrifice some time into LBP, if you can.

I understand what you're saying, but the problem is that LBP has gotten stale. At some point when you're like most of us creators and have been around since the series booting in 2008(2009 or 2010 for me) or LBP2 in 2011, and have played levels for years, you realize that LBP3 just didn't do enough to shake up the formula and add a massive amount of replay value. Don't get me wrong, I loved the additions of LBP3. But eventually the game would get boring within months, because it wasn't something revolutionary like LBP2 that completely changed the formula. Overall, even if LBP3 had no bugs and the game had stable online at launch, it wouldn't make a difference. LBP was declining since LBP2, and while LBP3 tried to stop that declining(which is something I'm really grateful to Sumo-Digital for), ultimately it failed. The formula was getting old, especially if you've been with the series since LBP2 or 1. LBP3 still has a good creating community, but that's about it. People who just wanted to play levels for fun have left due to online issues, and not being able to connect at launch. Of course, I'm not treating this as fact, but that's just how I feel about the current state of LBP as a whole :(.

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Feels like a series in purgatory.

Sadly, my own interest waned midway last year. I still had projects and ideas, but frustrations with the toolset and glitches paired with a clearly waning community drove away my will to lose myself in those endeavors. Doesn't help that I'm not a teenager anymore (and haven't been for four years) and I'm taking on many more responsibilities and stresses.

I'd like to think that Dreams will revive both my interest and the interest of the general public, but response from many folks thus far seems to be tepid confusion, and that doesn't give me much hope for the long run.

I totally agree. We just don't have time to keep putting so much effort into making levels, only to not have them recognized( sadly, even posting on forums or advertising your levels on player profiles won't get you much plays. A lot of these issues started in LBP2, and set a deep trap for LBP3, a game that could have had so much potential, but fell for the endless cycle of decline that had long since began in lbp2. LBP was definitely an amazing creation game back in LBP1 and 2, but as more creative games rised, and LBP began to decline, it was in a hole far too deep for LBP3 to dig out of. Lack of increased logic and creation tools, along with glitches also hurt the experience :(. I love that LBP3 brought back LBP from the brink of extinction, but as Deviant_Oatmeal said, LBP won't die, it's legacy will continue on in Dreams :)

mdkd99
11-29-2016, 06:12 PM
I understand. I was amazed at LBP2. Holy moly. TopDown levels and so many things.

At LBP3 I was speechless. But: At LBP2 I was 12, and at LBP3 I was 16. The magic gets lost, because you get older. But I think, LittleBIGPlanet will be in this state for at least 2 years. There are still guys around in LBP1 and 2.

The possibilitys in LBP3 are big. And I will use them. NOW. :D

CuriousSack
11-30-2016, 05:58 PM
I can't agree, I'm really old, but the magic still hasn't got lost to me! I'm playing since 2011 and nearly exclusively lbp! But there are still so many level genres I didn't really try to do, so many ideas that I would like to do! :)

mdkd99
11-30-2016, 07:29 PM
Right. :D

I think when you grow up you see the hard life out there. Than your magic can get lost.

You remember things, which are part of the past, better than they were. Holy Moly, was that a correct english sentence? :D

Some people's magic got lost, and some people's didn't. Holy Moly, was that either correct?

koltonaugust
11-30-2016, 09:32 PM
I still play a lot, just my breaks are much longer due to double major college life. My breaks were always quite long and obnoxious because it halted all progress on my levels before I started implementing computer science concepts about object-oriented ideas so the names of things were very clear, and 100% copy-and-pasteable. My content on my moon is much more advanced than it ever was, but I also think I will never finish anything because of it :P

mdkd99
12-01-2016, 08:38 AM
Hmm, OK.

I also have some projects. I look forward to finish them.