Last update, hopefully. I got a two directional one to fit into the same little package. It uses flipped pistons, but I was able to stash them out of view. I added you on PSN so I can show you.
:)
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Last update, hopefully. I got a two directional one to fit into the same little package. It uses flipped pistons, but I was able to stash them out of view. I added you on PSN so I can show you.
:)
ahh nice! I checked out your 12h-level last night and it worked well! though I'm sure about holding the button to change the hours and minutes.
I'm a bigger fan of clicking for every change. If you wanna get past the unstableness when someone is hammering the trigger, you could use a regular jump-style button.. Kinda fool-proof actually, 'cus you can't activate that button as many times/sec as you can with a grab switch.
Or you could build some kind of delay, so you only can activate once every 0,5sec..
I liked the way you made it work with the emitters moving in and out of the mag-switch's view. Though it looked like alot of keys were emitted for no good reason :)
Sadly i couldn't play with it in Create-mode, since i doesn't have the history pack dlc.
About your last update:
Did you make the two-directional one without the 3-way-switch? With stacked bolts? just curious.. haven't tried that one myself.
Okey i might get in later tonight, it depends if it's a pub-night or not ;)
You're in the US, right? That means that there is atleast like 7hours time difference between us. :D
I am in the US, so it must be afternoon there (even though I just woke up). Even if we can't meet up, I can send stuff to you. And yes, it utilizes stacked bolts.
The reason that I had to emit all the keys in the clocky thing is to ensure the keys for the timed input and the manual input will never conflict. If someone were to change the minutes just as they were about to roll over, it could cause the whole thing to be misaligned. As it is now, the "manual keys" only emit at the same times as the automatic ones. Not the best system, I know, but it works. Perhaps I can use the flipper piston technique and just "turn off" the automatic input when it's active. For now I can't be bothered.
About the history pack - yeah, I used that for ticking sound. :(
Sorry for the delay..
been great playing with you comphemc. Glad that you liked what i've been working on. Though I will take care of all the dated logic pieces I have in my debuging levels.. :D
I'm kinda stoked that the .2 piston worked so perfectly! :) Though i feel its wierd that it tripples the defined degrees. But we can live with that i think.. :S
I've been experimenting with the 2-way stacked bolts solution.. sadly it isn't as exact as using the 3-way-switch to control the direction.. :(
It starts to turn more/less then the specified degree after a couple of full rotations.
Do you have the same problem?
BTW: Thanks for the tip about wexxfordians level! Frickin awesome that he's been able to build that!!! I must start working on my own single/double/hold button!
I saw your comment in the other thread...
I haven't been having any problems with it, to be honest. I'm not sure if the material choice has any effect, but I'm using polystyrene. The TV I have here just died, so I can't really do any testing right now... :(
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tamland
Not at all. I believe magnetic key sample rate in 0.05s, so you would comfortably get 1 detection in 0.1s motion and 3 in 0.2s motion. If you modify the mag switch radius you should be able to force a doubling of the defined degrees.
Hmm.. Yeah the material can have a role in this problem.. Will check it out when I get home from work.. (probably shouldn't spend company time on lbpc :) )
A completely different question: how would you build a multiple input XOR? I have two soultions that I think will work.. But I can see som stability problems...
//Mattias
Easiest solution is to use the old-school AND gate from the logic pack and place a key in a location where it only activates when the desired number of inputs are true.
Stacked wobble bolts. If you have a thin layer base of dark matter, then stack a thick layer on that, with a thin layer on top, you get no stability issues as the weight proportions are high enough. Then do the same behind the dark matter and you get 4 inputs with no stability issues. Wobbles all turn 90 degrees to give the correct effect. The mag switch looks across the axis to detect at 90/270 degrees.
Beyond 4, you are going to have to play with material sizings / densities to get stability
Edit: regarding comphermc's post - depends how you are defining xor with more than one input ;)
Yeah, yeah... or just put a key in every other spot and put the switch on the moving part... ;)
A few extra keys never killed anyone...
can you please explain what this does in laymans terms?
It's a wheel toggle, but without the notches... :)
In other words, it's awesome!
how is that possible? :cry:
switch on a motor bolt of known speed for specific amount of time -> known number of degrees rotation.
oh right so its all a matter of testing?
It's a matter of knowing that the speed of the motor bolt is directly related to angle it sweeps out every .05 seconds. An n speed motor bolt will turn n degrees when triggered ON by a .1 second flipper piston quickly entering and leaving the mag-key radius.
Not exactly. The timing of the input is very predictable and tamland has pretty much nailed the motor bolt speeds, so the testing is more "sanity checking" rather than building using trial and error.
IMO it's a simpler method to implement than the notched wheel and can be extended to bi-directional.
Have I mentioned lately how much you guys amaze me..... oh sure - I leave drooling and feeling like a brain damaged Emu but always amazed.
This is a really cool idea and while I have no clue why I'd need to use it I feel compelled to find one.... Thanks as always for the research and never ending amounts of smarty pantsness! :)
Thanks for all the response I've been given!!!
Yeah that's one of the ways that i thought of.. though i dont like the bouncyness when you move a piston that isn't the one on the end.. Makes me question it.. quite alot actually.. and if you turn off all the inputs at the same time it will have to pass through the magnetic switch, which makes me doubt it even more :/Quote:
Originally Posted by comphermc
Read on to see the other solution I have for the n XOR (as i now will call it :idea: If you guys doesn't have a better name for it) :)
Hmm.. will look in to this in the tommorow..Quote:
Originally Posted by rtm223
Though the two wheels on the back won't be that useful. Just put them side by side and let the wheels share a rectangular piece of darkmatter, it shouldn't be any difference in the thermo.. Right?
:D the n XOR i'm talking about is supposed to handle i.e 5 inputs and it should only be in an active state if one of these inputs are active.Quote:
Originally Posted by rtm223
0 inputs on = n XOR off
1 input on = n XOR on
2< inputs on = n XOR off
My first solution as mentioned above is a simple "old-school" and with pistons connected in a series with cardboard between each piston.
Here is a brief overview of how it's set up.
Code:DM = Dark Matter
mk = Magnetic Key
ms = Magnetic Switch
-p- = Piston
__ _ _ _ _ __
|DM|-p-|_|-p-|_|-p-|_|-p-|_|-p-|mk|
| |_________________________________
| ms|
And Now to my new and improved(?) version of the n XOR.
Look at the setup and you should be able to make some sense out of this. Hopefully :D
Code:|------------------|
| Tweaking : |
|-/\--/\--/\--/\--/|
__ ___ |/--\/--\/--\/--\/-|
___ |DM|-p2-| | | -p1- = Piston 1: |
| |-p1-| |-w2-| | | Strength : 5.0 |
| |-w1-| |-w2-| | | Time : 0.1 |
| |-w1-| |-w2-| | | Stiff : Yes |
| |-w1-| |-w2-| | | Inverted : Yes |
|ms1|-w1-|mk|-w2-|ms2| |------------------|
| -w1- = Winch 1: |
|-----------------------| | Strength : 10.0 |
| Connecting : | | Time : 0.1 |
|-/\--/\--/\--/\--/\--/\| | Inverted : Yes |
|/--\/--\/--\/--\/--\/--| |------------------|
| Input 1 --> p1 & w2 | | -p2- = Piston 2: |
| Input 2 --> w1 & w2 | | Strength : 8.5 |
| Input etc... | | Time : 0.1 |
|-----------------------| | Stiff : Yes |
| ms1 --> p2 | | Inverted : No |
| ms2 = XOR true/false | |------------------|
|-----------------------| | -w2- = Winch 2: |
| Strength : 8.0 |
| Time : 0.1 |
| Inverted : Yes |
|------------------|
Spoiler - Some lame excuse...
Explanation :
This new and improved(?) n XOR works with a simple piece of logic. (Even though it probably doesn't look like it.)
The main concept of it is by using different strengths on the connectors (p2 and w2). So that you need atleast the strength of 2 winches to exceed the strength of the piston and basically force the value into false.
This is pretty much what the right side of the part does.
The "junk" on the left is a simple OR switch that controls the piston on the right-hand-side. So the n XOR is true when 1 of the inputs are true.
Problems :
- Need some tweaking before it works 100% Hope you guys have an answer for this. But the brief testing I did i came to the conclusion that the strength the winches are actually using is depending on how far away they are from the piston.. This caused the contraption to shake like a paintmixer... Though as soon as you find the right Strength value it works perfectly. (tested it with up to 12 inputs.)
- A slight larger latency than the "old school" n XOR latency of because it has to work itself through 2 steps before it can send the true/false value.
- More connectors...
EDIT: I'm probaby off topic with all this n XOR talk.. Start a New "n XOR thread"
Whoa, nice.
The only thing I would change is to make the winches and pistons all have a strength of 10. This should eliminate the strength issues when the winch is further from the piston (two 10 strength winches will still overpower a single strength 10 piston). The winch should not be able to overpower the piston when they are the same. I'm not 100% on that.
Dangit, now I want to test this. It'll have to wait until tomorrow.
As for the thread, you can just change the title if it's easier, and edit the original post to eliminate any confusion.
Edit: Y'know, what? I completely forgot that the way you and I are trying to define a higher order XOR gate is somewhat incorrect. In actuality, it should deliver a TRUE output when there are an odd number of true inputs. This means it should also "activate" when there are 3, 5, 7, ... true inputs. For that, there really is no better solution than the pistons-in-series when you get to a high enough number of inputs. I'll add a picture in a moment when I whip it up. (If you are concerned about reliability, add glass).
Here we go:
http://www.lbpcentral.com/forums/att...1&d=1262758653
It should be pretty self explanatory. It only "hits" a key when there are an odd number of inputs. Forgive the spacing, lol. I was just wanting a photoshop refresher. Notice that there are tiny little spaces between them initially. LBP doesn't like moving materials to be flush, so this is to ensure reliability.
:)