The Music Editor

Well, it's been announced. In the lastest trailer, (for a few seconds) the music editor was shown, and man does it look good.

Now, I paused the trailer and took two pictures for a close look at what we will be dealing with:

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/y...siceditor1.png

http://i796.photobucket.com/albums/y...siceditor2.png

http://www.blogcdn.com/www.joystiq.c...8/lbpmusic.jpg

Here's a video showing it off!: http://gamescom.gamespot.com/video/6274015/

So, what do you think?

EDIT: New Joystiq interview on the Music Editor: (Thanks to robotiod) http://www.joystiq.com/2010/08/19/me...an-just-music/

I think I need to find me some musically inclined friends. :D

This will be "Teh Epicness"

I have some ideas on this.
You select the music box (the LBP1 looking speaker in the first picture)
The first menu appears.
Here you can select the instrument type used.
Then you can tweak each note via the secondary menu (lower pic)
Here you choose which note it is and it's duration and whether or not it changes midway (the lines that crossover)

Presumably the options are volume and others and the Visuals make different notes easier to keep track of.

Any one want to add to this, or change?

I'd say you're pretty much correct. I expect the blocks in the first picture are moveable and copyable, so you can arrange your music piece by piece.

Alright. Lemme get to work breaking down these images.

- The notes are on a material with notes on it. Probably a special material kind of like circuit boards. (EDIT: Yup, I see that it expanded out of one of those music players. So you can drag and drop a blank music box, make your own music, than save it in the menu.)

- Each note can be expanded into the editor. I think that that one note is containing the tune in the bottom picture, which means that it's condensed music waaay more.

- Holy crap that's a lot of colours to choose from for the notes. I'm pretty sure that that's organizational, and that the colour doesn't have an actual effect on anything.

- Not sure what the piano keys on the very right of the first image is for.

- Controls;
+Instrument
+Volume
+Left/right speaker balance
+Not sure
+Not sure
+You can change the scale of the music
+You can change the key of the music
+You can change the colour of the note

- It looks like each note object plays like Mario Paint, ala a bar goes across the top and plays each note it crosses.

- Individual notes (within the note object) can be any length, and can change pitch during.

I'll add more if I find it.

Sheesh, I should make a breakdown with all this.

I'm betting this is going to lead to people who just make music, and then people hire them to make music for their level.

I know some musically talented people, so I'll probably be seeing if they can make stuff for me :D

If you pause at the right time, you can see the third option is Echo Send and the fourth is Echo Reverb. I'm not an expert, but I think that's synthesizer stuff.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Moony

- Holy crap that's a lot of colours to choose from for the notes. I'm pretty sure that that's organizational, and that the colour doesn't have an actual effect on anything.

- Not sure what the piano keys on the very right of the first image is for.

---

The colour might have an effect on the look of the music object in the level. You know, lights flashing to the tune?

I think the piano image just shows what type of instrument is connected to that particular music block, so you don't have to open the second menu to see.

This looks very useful indeed.

This looks to work very much like GarageBand. Just as Moony said, and just like a microchip, the boom box can expand and a circuit-board-esque material is opened. However, it looks to me like there are actual tracks built in, to allow for easy organisation of your music. Each music block looks like a non-physical object much like one of the new logic gates, and each block, as made evident with the Popit, looks to contain a series of notes, not just one. I would think they can be copied and pasted (say, you made a full bar of a drum beat, this could be repeated throughout your song).

Being experienced in GarageBand and having made many musical compositions with it for professional projects, I can safely say that this music editor is advanced enough to sate ANY LBP1-music-maker's hunger, whilst making the whole process ten times easier.

I think the two unknown slider/speakers (3rd and 4th from the top) might be bass and treble controls. Frequency tuning and what not. so you could make some bassy synths without using really really low notes.

nvm. video clearly shows echo send and reverb send.

So are you guys saying you have to individually place every note via those blocks? That's sounds like it would take years to make a piece of music for a level!

Well - now we know that pitch-perfect recreations of all the classic Mario tunes will be built and shared to everyone within the first three days.


Good to know I suppose! :hero:

well im doing btec music so this should'nt be a problem after a month

Quote:

---

So are you guys saying you have to individually place every note via those blocks? That's sounds like it would take years to make a piece of music for a level!

---

you don't place them individually by block. you make a pattern in that 2nd picture, then sequence them in that first picture.

@Cog

Everything I hoped for and more ;)

:love:

I can't wait to get my hands on this game and get to work

but I'm going to have to study and learn about music (since i'm not a musician :()
I can't half it and do the same stuff I did in LBP1, I got to do better with the new tool

i have ideas for what i want to do, i can't wait to put it in action :)

It looks very interesting. It won't help me at all because I can't read music but it looks like it should be much easier for people who do.

You can still easily cobble together a tune even if you have no musical experience. Especially since this has nothing to do with reading music.

I don't think you need to read music to use this. I used to play a little with music maker programs, they weren't that difficult, and this looks even more userfriendly. I think it will be easy to make a composition.

The tricky part will be to make a good composition, that's where the musical talent comes in. :p

this looks a bit like hobnox audio tool, but more indepth.

This will be amazing! No more hearing the same music tracks over and over again if people use this! Hopefully it isn't too confusing to use though.

I'm guessing you put down a block (for one instrument maybe), open it up into the second window and make your little tune, then place it in the track and slowly make more (copy and paste it, tweaking them). You can layer it on the tracks depending on how many instruments you want to hear simultaneously. Whether its a solo ditty or a whole orchestra.

I'm betting there's something that makes the tracks loop too.

I just hope they instruments don't sound so tinny and flat, like banging pots and pans in a small cabinet. All the current custom songs now sound so.. fake. Everything except the piano..

Somehow I don't think they'd force us to use tinny instruments.

Good instrument sounds aren't that hard to come by.

This looks awesome...I should start writing the music now...oh well, I'll get to it eventually. I can already tell I will be spending a lot of time with this tool.

one of the problems i had with the first game... music. They could never suit my level. Glad we can make our own easy now.

I just realised there's a bit of a downside here. Players will come to expect custom music, which means more work for creators. And up till now I thought LBP2 was going to save me time... :p

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Rogar

I just realised there's a bit of a downside here. Players will come to expect custom music, which means more work for creators. And up till now I thought LBP2 was going to save me time... :p

---

eh..,I'll understand if a level doesn't have custom music, but if it does it's a bonus! :p

Well I was never really too excited about music editor when it was mostly speculation. I have to say, though, this does look very cool and I can't wait to give it a spin.

For those of you who are worried about having to compose every note, I wouldn't worry. I'm sure LBP2 will come with a Selection of "duplo" loops that you can mix and match to make a song. Aslo, I'm sure that many creators will be happy to create bits, pieces and parts to help out the speed-minded little-big-producer.

The second, larger picture looks like a piano roll. Basically it works like a music box. That's good for people who aren't comfortable using a Grand staff. Looks like it allows you to (slur) notes together.
(a slur is when you shift the pitch in mid note, rather thand starting a new note.)

While I was watching the Video, I noticed a couple of things:
Effects send- (reverb and delay) leads me to believe that there is a page for master levels and over all effects. Possibly even effect parameters. The thing about using a send is, it implys that all instruments share effects. for example if you have the reverb set to a long decay , all instruments that use it will have a long reverb.

Scale &key in the video, the key parameters flashed through "chromatic" and "Major" My guess is that "Chromatic" Will allow the notes to play as is, While The other settings will transpose into a certain key/chord depending on the setting. What's interesting to me here, is that music on this page is not written in the key of C. it's in A, So that might mean that it's transposing on the fly ala casio.

It looks to me like the gradation of color on the notes means somthing. Volume, Perhaps?

I think you are right about the first pic. I looks like a master loop schedule. it looks like the rows are instruments, and color is for individual note or sequence patterns. What I'm hoping, is that we will be able to clone note patterns to different instruments by placing that pattern in a different track.


since in the video this opens from a yellow tab, and the yellow color is selected under visuals, I think it's a safe guess that the visuals have to do with loop organisation, and not individual notes. I'm not seeing any loop names. I hope that it's not just down to color to ID your patterns!

I'll transcribe this snippit, and post later.
___edit___

Okay, here's what I got from the second picture...The notes are accurite accurate ( more than I can say for my typing :P), but who knows what type of sound they were using.
Also, it's only the first bit. The rest is just me having some fun.
http://www.newgrounds.com/audio/listen/356368

-edit #2-

Arrugh! *slaps forehead* how stupid am I?
I just realized what the tune is. This screen shot leaves off most of the first note in the bar. it's actually part of what's playing on the trailer. lol
on my version the melody is sped up a little, and moved forward to the beat.
heck with it. I've never tried to transcribe from a screenshot of a game piano roll before, anyway. hahaha!

Oooh, look at all those fancy words, an expert at last! ;)

I have another theory on the scale. Chromatic means you get to use all 12 notes, maybe major (and I'm sure there's a minor, too) will only let you pick from 7 notes, to help noobs (like me) keep it in harmony.

Would loop names be that important? I'd just play the loop in a... uhm.. loop, when selected.

It REALLY does look good. You have that piano thing to place the notes + effects on them and the other screen to do your sequences.

It clearly looks like a sequencer/tracker. I am in HEAVEN. This pushes LBP2 WAY FREAKING FURTHER into the world of creativity than LBP1. Believe me.
And since the sound samples are on the disk, it will take quite nothing it matter of thermo. Most probably the same thermo space as the regular LBP radios.

Just imagine the picture. With sackbots, linked level and this music editor, I will finally be able to make ENTIRELY custom levels and adventures. I am speechless. This is the GOTY right there. And probably the GOTF.

.

Game of the Future? :p

With this new gizmo, I can make custom tracks for my levels! Which means no more Get it Together in every level...

:SH:

I'm going to make a level called "100 COLOR JUMPS WITH SHARKS" and publish it copyable. Make it so that you fall onto a shared music box with my custom made "Never gonna give you up". This way it'll be easy for people to share it. I'll also hack the game so that the tune spreads throughout the world with no way to stop it.

So... does this mean we can remake GaGa tracks? :o

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RangerZero

And since the sound samples are on the disk, it will take quite nothing it matter of thermo. Most probably the same thermo space as the regular LBP radios.

---

There is an internal limitation on the amount you can get into a track, but it is very close to thermoless, in the eyes of the level. And as the sequences themselves are loaded into memory as needed, I guess that you can have several (not sure though). Anyways, take that select switch with millions of outputs!

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by rtm223

Take that select switch with millions of outputs!

---

Say Hello to music boxes with insane complexity! XD

the music editor is a huge improvement in lbp 2 .

Wow, they are making it almost like LMMS. Cool.
Some examples of what LMMS can do.

Also,

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by RangerZero

And probably the GOTF.

---

GOTF?

The music editor intimidates me. Yet, the funny thing about it is that that intimidation makes me wanna try to make music in this game even if I don't know how.